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House Democrat Unveils Bill to Cut Off Funding for Trump's Iran War (www.commondreams.org)
submitted 3 months ago by to c/politics@lemmy.world
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[–] 58 points 3 months ago (10 children)

I’m waiting for the inevitable cry of “ending this war is antisemitism”.

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  • [–] 23 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    You're probably aware but if not. It's already a rallying cry. "Iran is threatening everyone including Israel, if we don't defend them Iran will destroy Israel, your an antisemite of you don't support stopping Iran first"

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  • [–] 7 points 3 months ago* (1 child)

    The inevitable conclusion to this shit is "ok, guess I'm an antisemite then".

    Do they think labels of bigotry will make people change their opinion? Do they know what fucking country they live in? That doesn't even work when the labeling of bigots is true. Hell, they end up in the white house.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago

    It's kinda like saying "you're being racist by supporting affirmative action." It's like alright rather be racist than have every workplace/university be 99% white because they can afford good schools/prep material...

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  • [+] -12 points 3 months ago* (5 children)

    Right now, for everyone except Israel and Iran, the war is about opening the Strait of Hormuz and stopping Iran from collecting a toll there. Letting Iran continue like they do now would set a terrible precedent for global trade.

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  • [–] 8 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    Right, despite starting this was with the expressed intention of collapsing their society, we can't have America not go back to the status quo of imposing sanctions on Iran while Iran spends money and resources every year for maritime upkeep so American trade can continue to pass through freely. We wouldn't want terrible precedents set.

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  • [–] -2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

    I'm at a bit of a loss as to where to start replying to this. Nowhere did I imply that I was in favor of Trump, or that I don't consider this war to be an embarrassing and horrific mistake, or that I found the previous status quo to be ideal - and even if I did imply it, it is quite irrelevant as to whether or not what I posted was true.

    ...and it is true. The closure of the strait is a huge threat to global trade, and the rules and norms that keep it flowing - and thus it's a threat to all of our economies.

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  • [–] 5 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    The status quo that you claim to not find ideal and don't think is relevant is what enabled the global trade you think is being threatened. The rules and norms imposed by the US by threat of force.

    Oh no, the ship is charged $1 million to pass through the straight, how will global trade survive!?

    I've seen estimates the fee would range from 1-5% of total ship cargo value on average. Hardly threatening global trade.

    Repay them for all the war damages, remove all sanctions, give them their frozen assets back, and then ask them kindly to allow free passage through the straight again. But this whole we're gonna bomb you, kill your religious leader, kill hundreds of your children, destroy your civilian infrastructure, and we want you to go back to the deal that gives us an advantage doesn't work when they destroyed all your assets in the region, drained your munitions, and put on display your actual lack of power for all to see. Pay up, it's you're turn.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 months ago

    You misunderstood me. What I meant is that who I am, or what my opinions are on other matters, is quite irrelevant as to whether I'm right about this.

    But for the record: I am not American, I'm European, I consider the war to be a tragic and embarrassing mistake, and I think the threats and whole attitude of the American administration reeks of naiveté and macho bullshit. It would be wonderful if the US would aid in rebuilding and cleaning up the mess they've made (and maybe just recognize for half a second the damage that can't be repaired, like all the lives lost), but given past experiences I wouldn't hold my breath.

    However, while those rules may have been enforced by the US, they have been internationally agreed upon, and they benefited pretty much everyone else as well. In fact, as far as I'm aware, the goods flowing through the strait are mostly headed towards Asia. Americans are unlikely to be much directly affected by these tolls - but just like everyone else, they will be indirectly affected by friction being added to global trade.

    I doubt Iran will find many friends here - especially since there are other straits as well, and countries that trade through them will likely want to set an example, so no one thinks to copy Iran's attempts. Because of this, I'm pretty sure the sanctions (which are also internationally agreed upon) are unlikely to be lifted without free passage through the strait.

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    • [–] 27 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    Which happens first... Funding gets cut or run out of munitions?

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago

    The goal right now is to get Europe involved via Ukraine. They are testing the waters right now.

    But, I think they miscalculate Europeans. They don't care about Ukraine. They care about NOT becoming Ukraine.

    If Europe gets involved all of Europe gets stuck in the same meat grinder for America as Ukraine has been in.

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    • [–] 22 points 3 months ago (4 children)

    For something that’s not a war because all this was done illegally based under other false pretexts and “names”, this sure does sound, feel, and act like it is in fact, a war.

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  • [–] 11 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

    Yeah that's the thing: This was basically all legal (war crimes aside). The US political system has been shifting towards this being acceptable for at least two generations. The president gets to wage war wherever he feels like it in America.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (2 children)

    I'd argue it started with Jackson. "Mr. Marshall has made his decision, now let's see him enforce it " Teddy didn't help things with his run around Congress. It's been there damn near the whole time, at least ever since Congress started cedeing power to the president in the early 1800s.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago* (1 child)

    I think Jackson was more of a precursor/canary in the coalmine than the start of the process, since the American system of government basically stayed at equilibrium for a little over a century after that until it started fraying at the edges with Nixon.

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    • [+] 7 points 3 months ago* (4 children)
    [removed by mod]
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  • [–] -1 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    hi i’m from the secret service. we would like a word,

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    • [–] 6 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    The last time Congress shut off funding for a war, the Reagan Administration created the Iran-Conta Affair, and spawned the crack cocaine epidemic that killed millions of Americans.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Not sure if you are blaming Congress for that or saying that we're likely to have a repeat of that bullshit from Trump.

    I have to admit the repeat scenario is pretty likely, there's a lot of morons who are more than willing to dive in front of the fucking bullet for this octogenarian POS.

    The question is, would any Congress have the courage and integrity to go after the mother fucker this time? Because the feckless Democrats just let Ollie North jump in front and take all of the blame wow Reagan walked free.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago

    Ollie North walked free, too. When George HW took over as president, his AG, Bob Barr, gave him the legal cover to pardon EVERYBODY involved in the treason of the Iran-Contra Affair, one of the most egregious cases of treason in American history.

    Bob Barr, helping presidents avoid accountability for decades.

    Ollie North should have swung from a rope, instead of being treated as an American hero on FoxNews. Notice that no other news organization will talk to him, or even acknowledge his existence.

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    • [–] 9 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    If that happens then how will the Orange Shitgoblin kill innocent children, huh?
    Why won't anyone think of the Shitgoblin's murderous desires!!??!

    Oh, wait, don't worry. I've just read that Shitler's regime are cutting Medicare aid, which will kill thousands and thousands in the long run. Phew, I was a bit worried there for a second.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Well if he can't kill innocent children anymore, he'll just have to go back to raping them.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago

    At that things age?

    Ok, after having a quick think I suggest the fat orange imbecile takes a dosage of 1000 highest strength viagras, all at once, to get the wrinkly mushroom tingling. Or a quick injection of 200ml of bleach...

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    • [–] -1 points 3 months ago

    Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

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    [+] -7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (11 children)

    Islam has more heart than American culture. Americans are slaves for monsters. Nothing more.

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  • [–] 8 points 3 months ago

    I am all for hating in American culture, but every Abrahamic religion is rife with hypocrisy. They all are very willing to overlook the fundamental 'do not kill' maxim and for slavery they are quite apt to make loopholes. Just look at the foreign 'laborers' that are worked to death in Quatar and the UAE.

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  • [–] 7 points 3 months ago (8 children)

    Stoning a woman takes a lot of heart.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (2 children)

    Lmao like the u.s. doesn't execute male and female prisoners

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  • [–] -3 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    I doubt anyone here particularly cares about the details, but the only crime whose punishment is stoning in Islam is extramarital sex for married people caught in the act by four valid witnesses, and it's not gendered (and also vanishingly rare even in the past), so I'm not sure what you mean by "stoning a woman."

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  • [–] 9 points 3 months ago* (1 child)

    that makes it okay, then!

    Fuck all religion. It's backwards, superstitious trash that turns brother against brother for nothing more than headcanon superiority and societal control.

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  • [–] -4 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 child)

    😂 and America doesn't fuck lives up or fund nations that fuck lives up. It's the game dunn. All of that aspect is the enemy of humanity regardless of Christianity, American nationalism or Islam. But still Islam has more heart than America's slave culture. All your "freedom" is psychological manipulation to make you believe you have freedom. Shit that's what CIA ethics are based off... Everything is fine if you convince the people it's freewill, even if your convincing them to commit suicide, mass murders, or go to war for the pathetic psychopath mindset.

    All of it is dog shit humanity worth eternal torture.

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    • 1 comment in c/politics@lemmy.dbzer0.com view that post
    [–] 6 points 3 months ago

    yay! I love performative gestures...

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