▲ 452 ▼ In China, the AI bubble has already burst (www.reuters.com) submitted 1 week ago by inari@piefed.zip to c/technology@lemmy.world 143 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[+] Ferrous@lemmy.ml -46 points 1 week ago (55 children) oppressive authoritarianism permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 55 child comments replies: [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 65 points 1 week ago (17 children) People who have never experienced democracy and have only been fed lies by their authoritarian government think their country is democratic and equal. Shocker. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 17 child comments replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 44 points 1 week ago (7 children) One can say the same about the US... Just saying. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 week ago To some extent... But in the USA until recently people never had reason to fear speaking out against their government. Which people? The FBI killed Black Panther organizer Fred Hampton in his bed, back in the 60s. The Red Scare was a decade before that. And the back in the 1930s, The Bonus Army, a movement of World War 1 veterans demanding payment for their service from the government, was violently crushed by the united States military. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FE80@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Probably because it accomplishes nothing. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/63/WTO_protests_in_Seattle_November_30_1999.jpg That's from 1999, in the US. permalink fedilink source parent [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Why would I when it‘s so off-topic? The fact you guys still do blatant whataboutism is telling. Try to be innovative for once. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... China learned most of what they do from the US. Same with Nazis in Germany, they took their playbook from the US. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies) [–] DaddleDew@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (1 child) For managed democracy! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Happy Liberty Day! permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago You’re talking about the US, right? permalink fedilink source parent [–] belochka@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago (2 children) There's also been a certain "Soviet democracy", the democracy perception of which in the polls would be sky high especially under dear Stalin and Voroshilov leading it with iron hand, and less when dissent stopped getting you executed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Same thing with China. Dissent gets punished brutally. Young protesters are dying in camps in the thousands. The Chinese government just doesn‘t let the tanks roll in anymore. Instead they utilize mass surveillance to track down each and every protester and deport them from home. Tiananmen square massacres are happening every day behind closed doors. That‘s why the public thinks it‘s a democracy despite one party controlling everything openly, down to who may run against them in local elections. Or they‘re too afraid to say otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] belochka@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago And then one can think one step further and realize that western nations are not very far from similarly detecting dissenters before they do anything useful, and they don't need camps, just subtly directing them in life onto paths not harmful to the establishment and unlikely to bring offspring. Big data and social media magic. permalink fedilink source parent [+] Ferrous@lemmy.ml -9 points 1 week ago (2 children) So then why did Russians in the same study claim abysmal democracy? Aren't they afraid of the KGB? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) The Russian psyche is one of pessimistic resignation. Its also true that Russia has never experienced free democracy. There are many who believe the fall of the USSR was a terrible thing and they blame “democracy” for their current circumstances. This is part of why Putin gets away with authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago Non sequitur that has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of the graph. permalink fedilink source parent [–] LemmySuxNow@reddthat.com 18 points 1 week ago (3 children) So people in a nation where disagreeing with leadership is punished all agree with leadership. Interesting... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] GalacticSushi@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 1 week ago (1 child) I asked a man from North Korea how he felt about living in such a place. He replied: "eh, can't complain." permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago I asked someone from Switzerland and he said "Well the flag is a big plus." permalink fedilink source parent [–] Simon_Shitewood@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago You think the CCP is going to punish 140 million people over a poll? permalink fedilink source parent [–] mushroommunk@lemmy.today 21 points 1 week ago* (3 children) Using personal opinion of crowds is notoriously very bad and people are easily misguided. ALL this says is the Chinese BELIEVE they're democratic and all equal. Not that they actually are. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] friend_of_satan@lemmy.world 14 points 1 week ago* You're right, and I see that opinion poll as a indicator of the direction that America has been going: a place where many people think they are in a democracy, while actually living in a country that is more authoritarian than it was in the past. permalink fedilink source parent [–] anzo@programming.dev 6 points 1 week ago Also, westerners like myself tend to complain about trump/etc without acknowledging the continuum of raising fascism. We should focus on the lies we have been fed, it's not easy, nor late ;) permalink fedilink source parent [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 1 week ago Chinese citizens BELIEVE they’re democratic and all equal. Not that they actually are. I agree with that, yeah. permalink fedilink source parent [–] CybranM@feddit.nu 32 points 1 week ago (11 children) I'm sure you'll get similar results if you ask people in North Korea. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 11 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (5 children) That disagreement with the government is not popular there. Edit: don't know why I'm getting downvoted, I'm confident that that was the point, you're shooting the messenger lol permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] nullspace@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (3 children) It's really funny to me seeing someone using a chart showcasing oppressive authoritarianism a gotcha against an accusation of oppressive authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime seems to be unfalsifiable. If approval ratings are high it's because the people are being silenced and secretly hate their government. If approval is low it's because they hate their government. If the approval ratings are real then they've been brainwashed by nationalism. Like everything indicates the approval ratings are real, there were studies conducted by Western universities that didn't have stake in the matter and most Chinese citizens had a positive opinion of the PRC. There's no way to fake this kind of stuff as well as you're describing for decades. There are various reasons for why I can understand Chinese citizens like China. They're entering the golden age of their economy right now and legitimately have competitive quality of life when compared to Americans. Their country is becoming a superpower and that could be a source of national pride for some Chinese citizens. I think those reasons can explain the results without adding in coercion. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago* (1 child) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is unfalsifiable. you are taking a logical leap here. it's more accurate to say my belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is not falsifiable by a public opinion poll. there are plenty other options that may falsify it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] p03locke@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 week ago Chinese who don't say these opinions are labeled a dissonant and oppressed by their government. Just like how elections are completely staged in dictatorships. This graph is completely useless. permalink fedilink source parent [–] redballooon@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* Perception is a tricky business. But you are not posting this to talk about the perception, instead to suggest that there somehow is democracy in a state where only one party is allowed to exist. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ThirdConsul@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 week ago (3 children) I mean... Can Chinese people vote out the current party and pick something else? Yes? No? No. How the fuck is it a democracy then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 13 points 1 week ago Elections being postponed during wartime is pretty standard. If he won't voluntarily leave office when the war's over then we can talk about it not being a democracy. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 8 points 1 week ago Given the exponentially oversized influence that rich capitalists have on politics everywhere that is not socialist, it is evidently more democratic to not allow them to participate in politics at all. You know, governance of the people, by the people, and all that. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 week ago (6 children) get outta here with your facts. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] LemmySuxNow@reddthat.com 0 points 1 week ago (3 children) What fact do you believe is presented in this image? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) the image shows perception of democracy is much higher in china than other countries generally considered to be developed democracies by western discourse. i thought this was self-evident. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago what? no they won't lol permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com -5 points 1 week ago (1 child) I don't need a .ml telling me shit permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 week ago jimmies rustled permalink fedilink source parent [–] GeneralEmergency@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Aw dude permalink fedilink source parent [–] psx_crab@lemmy.zip 0 points 1 week ago Ohh hey, opinion poll, like a toilet paper. permalink fedilink source parent [–] LewdLemon@sh.itjust.works -4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) These are great proof of China's superiority! Until you see the Chinese questionnaires: Choose an option: [ ] My government serves the people [ ] I want my social credit score to take a nosedive. No more bank loans, government permits, study or career opportunities for me, please! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 1 week ago Social credit score doesn't apply to regular people in the PRC. It's for corporations and sometimes politicians. https://youtu.be/wYaKoDyIvWA permalink fedilink source parent
[–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 65 points 1 week ago (17 children) People who have never experienced democracy and have only been fed lies by their authoritarian government think their country is democratic and equal. Shocker. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 17 child comments replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 44 points 1 week ago (7 children) One can say the same about the US... Just saying. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 week ago To some extent... But in the USA until recently people never had reason to fear speaking out against their government. Which people? The FBI killed Black Panther organizer Fred Hampton in his bed, back in the 60s. The Red Scare was a decade before that. And the back in the 1930s, The Bonus Army, a movement of World War 1 veterans demanding payment for their service from the government, was violently crushed by the united States military. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FE80@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Probably because it accomplishes nothing. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/63/WTO_protests_in_Seattle_November_30_1999.jpg That's from 1999, in the US. permalink fedilink source parent [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Why would I when it‘s so off-topic? The fact you guys still do blatant whataboutism is telling. Try to be innovative for once. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... China learned most of what they do from the US. Same with Nazis in Germany, they took their playbook from the US. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies) [–] DaddleDew@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (1 child) For managed democracy! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Happy Liberty Day! permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago You’re talking about the US, right? permalink fedilink source parent [–] belochka@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago (2 children) There's also been a certain "Soviet democracy", the democracy perception of which in the polls would be sky high especially under dear Stalin and Voroshilov leading it with iron hand, and less when dissent stopped getting you executed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Same thing with China. Dissent gets punished brutally. Young protesters are dying in camps in the thousands. The Chinese government just doesn‘t let the tanks roll in anymore. Instead they utilize mass surveillance to track down each and every protester and deport them from home. Tiananmen square massacres are happening every day behind closed doors. That‘s why the public thinks it‘s a democracy despite one party controlling everything openly, down to who may run against them in local elections. Or they‘re too afraid to say otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] belochka@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago And then one can think one step further and realize that western nations are not very far from similarly detecting dissenters before they do anything useful, and they don't need camps, just subtly directing them in life onto paths not harmful to the establishment and unlikely to bring offspring. Big data and social media magic. permalink fedilink source parent [+] Ferrous@lemmy.ml -9 points 1 week ago (2 children) So then why did Russians in the same study claim abysmal democracy? Aren't they afraid of the KGB? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) The Russian psyche is one of pessimistic resignation. Its also true that Russia has never experienced free democracy. There are many who believe the fall of the USSR was a terrible thing and they blame “democracy” for their current circumstances. This is part of why Putin gets away with authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago Non sequitur that has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of the graph. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 44 points 1 week ago (7 children) One can say the same about the US... Just saying. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 week ago To some extent... But in the USA until recently people never had reason to fear speaking out against their government. Which people? The FBI killed Black Panther organizer Fred Hampton in his bed, back in the 60s. The Red Scare was a decade before that. And the back in the 1930s, The Bonus Army, a movement of World War 1 veterans demanding payment for their service from the government, was violently crushed by the united States military. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FE80@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Probably because it accomplishes nothing. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/63/WTO_protests_in_Seattle_November_30_1999.jpg That's from 1999, in the US. permalink fedilink source parent [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Why would I when it‘s so off-topic? The fact you guys still do blatant whataboutism is telling. Try to be innovative for once. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... China learned most of what they do from the US. Same with Nazis in Germany, they took their playbook from the US. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (2 replies)
[–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 week ago To some extent... But in the USA until recently people never had reason to fear speaking out against their government. Which people? The FBI killed Black Panther organizer Fred Hampton in his bed, back in the 60s. The Red Scare was a decade before that. And the back in the 1930s, The Bonus Army, a movement of World War 1 veterans demanding payment for their service from the government, was violently crushed by the united States military. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FE80@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Probably because it accomplishes nothing. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/63/WTO_protests_in_Seattle_November_30_1999.jpg That's from 1999, in the US. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 29 points 1 week ago To some extent... But in the USA until recently people never had reason to fear speaking out against their government. Which people? The FBI killed Black Panther organizer Fred Hampton in his bed, back in the 60s. The Red Scare was a decade before that. And the back in the 1930s, The Bonus Army, a movement of World War 1 veterans demanding payment for their service from the government, was violently crushed by the united States military. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FE80@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Probably because it accomplishes nothing. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/63/WTO_protests_in_Seattle_November_30_1999.jpg That's from 1999, in the US. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Why would I when it‘s so off-topic? The fact you guys still do blatant whataboutism is telling. Try to be innovative for once. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... China learned most of what they do from the US. Same with Nazis in Germany, they took their playbook from the US. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ubergeek@lemmy.today 1 point 1 week ago I mean... China learned most of what they do from the US. Same with Nazis in Germany, they took their playbook from the US. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DaddleDew@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (1 child) For managed democracy! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Happy Liberty Day! permalink fedilink source parent
[–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago Happy Liberty Day! permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago You’re talking about the US, right? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] belochka@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago (2 children) There's also been a certain "Soviet democracy", the democracy perception of which in the polls would be sky high especially under dear Stalin and Voroshilov leading it with iron hand, and less when dissent stopped getting you executed. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Same thing with China. Dissent gets punished brutally. Young protesters are dying in camps in the thousands. The Chinese government just doesn‘t let the tanks roll in anymore. Instead they utilize mass surveillance to track down each and every protester and deport them from home. Tiananmen square massacres are happening every day behind closed doors. That‘s why the public thinks it‘s a democracy despite one party controlling everything openly, down to who may run against them in local elections. Or they‘re too afraid to say otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] belochka@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago And then one can think one step further and realize that western nations are not very far from similarly detecting dissenters before they do anything useful, and they don't need camps, just subtly directing them in life onto paths not harmful to the establishment and unlikely to bring offspring. Big data and social media magic. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago (1 child) Same thing with China. Dissent gets punished brutally. Young protesters are dying in camps in the thousands. The Chinese government just doesn‘t let the tanks roll in anymore. Instead they utilize mass surveillance to track down each and every protester and deport them from home. Tiananmen square massacres are happening every day behind closed doors. That‘s why the public thinks it‘s a democracy despite one party controlling everything openly, down to who may run against them in local elections. Or they‘re too afraid to say otherwise. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] belochka@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago And then one can think one step further and realize that western nations are not very far from similarly detecting dissenters before they do anything useful, and they don't need camps, just subtly directing them in life onto paths not harmful to the establishment and unlikely to bring offspring. Big data and social media magic. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] belochka@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago And then one can think one step further and realize that western nations are not very far from similarly detecting dissenters before they do anything useful, and they don't need camps, just subtly directing them in life onto paths not harmful to the establishment and unlikely to bring offspring. Big data and social media magic. permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Ferrous@lemmy.ml -9 points 1 week ago (2 children) So then why did Russians in the same study claim abysmal democracy? Aren't they afraid of the KGB? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) The Russian psyche is one of pessimistic resignation. Its also true that Russia has never experienced free democracy. There are many who believe the fall of the USSR was a terrible thing and they blame “democracy” for their current circumstances. This is part of why Putin gets away with authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago Non sequitur that has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of the graph. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ohulancutash@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) The Russian psyche is one of pessimistic resignation. Its also true that Russia has never experienced free democracy. There are many who believe the fall of the USSR was a terrible thing and they blame “democracy” for their current circumstances. This is part of why Putin gets away with authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago Non sequitur that has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of the graph. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago Non sequitur that has absolutely nothing to do with the validity of the graph. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LemmySuxNow@reddthat.com 18 points 1 week ago (3 children) So people in a nation where disagreeing with leadership is punished all agree with leadership. Interesting... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] GalacticSushi@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 1 week ago (1 child) I asked a man from North Korea how he felt about living in such a place. He replied: "eh, can't complain." permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago I asked someone from Switzerland and he said "Well the flag is a big plus." permalink fedilink source parent [–] Simon_Shitewood@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago You think the CCP is going to punish 140 million people over a poll? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] GalacticSushi@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 1 week ago (1 child) I asked a man from North Korea how he felt about living in such a place. He replied: "eh, can't complain." permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago I asked someone from Switzerland and he said "Well the flag is a big plus." permalink fedilink source parent
[–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago I asked someone from Switzerland and he said "Well the flag is a big plus." permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Simon_Shitewood@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 week ago You think the CCP is going to punish 140 million people over a poll? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mushroommunk@lemmy.today 21 points 1 week ago* (3 children) Using personal opinion of crowds is notoriously very bad and people are easily misguided. ALL this says is the Chinese BELIEVE they're democratic and all equal. Not that they actually are. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] friend_of_satan@lemmy.world 14 points 1 week ago* You're right, and I see that opinion poll as a indicator of the direction that America has been going: a place where many people think they are in a democracy, while actually living in a country that is more authoritarian than it was in the past. permalink fedilink source parent [–] anzo@programming.dev 6 points 1 week ago Also, westerners like myself tend to complain about trump/etc without acknowledging the continuum of raising fascism. We should focus on the lies we have been fed, it's not easy, nor late ;) permalink fedilink source parent [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 1 week ago Chinese citizens BELIEVE they’re democratic and all equal. Not that they actually are. I agree with that, yeah. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] friend_of_satan@lemmy.world 14 points 1 week ago* You're right, and I see that opinion poll as a indicator of the direction that America has been going: a place where many people think they are in a democracy, while actually living in a country that is more authoritarian than it was in the past. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] anzo@programming.dev 6 points 1 week ago Also, westerners like myself tend to complain about trump/etc without acknowledging the continuum of raising fascism. We should focus on the lies we have been fed, it's not easy, nor late ;) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 1 week ago Chinese citizens BELIEVE they’re democratic and all equal. Not that they actually are. I agree with that, yeah. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] CybranM@feddit.nu 32 points 1 week ago (11 children) I'm sure you'll get similar results if you ask people in North Korea. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 11 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (5 children) That disagreement with the government is not popular there. Edit: don't know why I'm getting downvoted, I'm confident that that was the point, you're shooting the messenger lol permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] nullspace@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (3 children) It's really funny to me seeing someone using a chart showcasing oppressive authoritarianism a gotcha against an accusation of oppressive authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime seems to be unfalsifiable. If approval ratings are high it's because the people are being silenced and secretly hate their government. If approval is low it's because they hate their government. If the approval ratings are real then they've been brainwashed by nationalism. Like everything indicates the approval ratings are real, there were studies conducted by Western universities that didn't have stake in the matter and most Chinese citizens had a positive opinion of the PRC. There's no way to fake this kind of stuff as well as you're describing for decades. There are various reasons for why I can understand Chinese citizens like China. They're entering the golden age of their economy right now and legitimately have competitive quality of life when compared to Americans. Their country is becoming a superpower and that could be a source of national pride for some Chinese citizens. I think those reasons can explain the results without adding in coercion. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago* (1 child) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is unfalsifiable. you are taking a logical leap here. it's more accurate to say my belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is not falsifiable by a public opinion poll. there are plenty other options that may falsify it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (5 children) That disagreement with the government is not popular there. Edit: don't know why I'm getting downvoted, I'm confident that that was the point, you're shooting the messenger lol permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (5 children) That disagreement with the government is not popular there. Edit: don't know why I'm getting downvoted, I'm confident that that was the point, you're shooting the messenger lol permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent
[–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (3 children) Because the government disappears dissenters. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago* (2 children) So then why in the same study do we see abysmal ratings for other authoritian dictatorships? Iraq, Kazakhstan, Cameroon, Russia, etc... If your point is that civilians in authoritarian regimes are coerced to show support in these types of polls, the results prove that notion wrong. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent
[–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 week ago* India being listed as a democracy doesn't help this point. India being above China and New Zealand is wild. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Trilogy3452@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago Does this study address the difference in circumstances? I can see for example China having the resources to maintain total surveillance abd strong censorship (especially on the internet) vs a developing country in Africa which may affect polling permalink fedilink source parent
[–] nullspace@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago (3 children) It's really funny to me seeing someone using a chart showcasing oppressive authoritarianism a gotcha against an accusation of oppressive authoritarianism. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime seems to be unfalsifiable. If approval ratings are high it's because the people are being silenced and secretly hate their government. If approval is low it's because they hate their government. If the approval ratings are real then they've been brainwashed by nationalism. Like everything indicates the approval ratings are real, there were studies conducted by Western universities that didn't have stake in the matter and most Chinese citizens had a positive opinion of the PRC. There's no way to fake this kind of stuff as well as you're describing for decades. There are various reasons for why I can understand Chinese citizens like China. They're entering the golden age of their economy right now and legitimately have competitive quality of life when compared to Americans. Their country is becoming a superpower and that could be a source of national pride for some Chinese citizens. I think those reasons can explain the results without adding in coercion. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago* (1 child) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is unfalsifiable. you are taking a logical leap here. it's more accurate to say my belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is not falsifiable by a public opinion poll. there are plenty other options that may falsify it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 25 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime seems to be unfalsifiable. If approval ratings are high it's because the people are being silenced and secretly hate their government. If approval is low it's because they hate their government. If the approval ratings are real then they've been brainwashed by nationalism. Like everything indicates the approval ratings are real, there were studies conducted by Western universities that didn't have stake in the matter and most Chinese citizens had a positive opinion of the PRC. There's no way to fake this kind of stuff as well as you're describing for decades. There are various reasons for why I can understand Chinese citizens like China. They're entering the golden age of their economy right now and legitimately have competitive quality of life when compared to Americans. Their country is becoming a superpower and that could be a source of national pride for some Chinese citizens. I think those reasons can explain the results without adding in coercion. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago* (1 child) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is unfalsifiable. you are taking a logical leap here. it's more accurate to say my belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is not falsifiable by a public opinion poll. there are plenty other options that may falsify it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] nialv7@lemmy.world 1 point 1 week ago* (1 child) Your belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is unfalsifiable. you are taking a logical leap here. it's more accurate to say my belief that China is an authoritarian oppressive regime is not falsifiable by a public opinion poll. there are plenty other options that may falsify it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] psycholocomotor_no2@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 1 week ago Okay true. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] p03locke@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 week ago Chinese who don't say these opinions are labeled a dissonant and oppressed by their government. Just like how elections are completely staged in dictatorships. This graph is completely useless. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] redballooon@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* Perception is a tricky business. But you are not posting this to talk about the perception, instead to suggest that there somehow is democracy in a state where only one party is allowed to exist. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ThirdConsul@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 week ago (3 children) I mean... Can Chinese people vote out the current party and pick something else? Yes? No? No. How the fuck is it a democracy then. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 13 points 1 week ago Elections being postponed during wartime is pretty standard. If he won't voluntarily leave office when the war's over then we can talk about it not being a democracy. permalink fedilink source parent [–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 8 points 1 week ago Given the exponentially oversized influence that rich capitalists have on politics everywhere that is not socialist, it is evidently more democratic to not allow them to participate in politics at all. You know, governance of the people, by the people, and all that. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 13 points 1 week ago Elections being postponed during wartime is pretty standard. If he won't voluntarily leave office when the war's over then we can talk about it not being a democracy. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 13 points 1 week ago Elections being postponed during wartime is pretty standard. If he won't voluntarily leave office when the war's over then we can talk about it not being a democracy. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 8 points 1 week ago Given the exponentially oversized influence that rich capitalists have on politics everywhere that is not socialist, it is evidently more democratic to not allow them to participate in politics at all. You know, governance of the people, by the people, and all that. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 week ago (6 children) get outta here with your facts. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] LemmySuxNow@reddthat.com 0 points 1 week ago (3 children) What fact do you believe is presented in this image? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) the image shows perception of democracy is much higher in china than other countries generally considered to be developed democracies by western discourse. i thought this was self-evident. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago what? no they won't lol permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply) [–] fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com -5 points 1 week ago (1 child) I don't need a .ml telling me shit permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 week ago jimmies rustled permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LemmySuxNow@reddthat.com 0 points 1 week ago (3 children) What fact do you believe is presented in this image? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) the image shows perception of democracy is much higher in china than other countries generally considered to be developed democracies by western discourse. i thought this was self-evident. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago what? no they won't lol permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children) the image shows perception of democracy is much higher in china than other countries generally considered to be developed democracies by western discourse. i thought this was self-evident. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago what? no they won't lol permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (1 reply)
[–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 point 1 week ago what? no they won't lol permalink fedilink source parent
[–] fyzzlefry@retrolemmy.com -5 points 1 week ago (1 child) I don't need a .ml telling me shit permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 week ago jimmies rustled permalink fedilink source parent
[–] psx_crab@lemmy.zip 0 points 1 week ago Ohh hey, opinion poll, like a toilet paper. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LewdLemon@sh.itjust.works -4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 child) These are great proof of China's superiority! Until you see the Chinese questionnaires: Choose an option: [ ] My government serves the people [ ] I want my social credit score to take a nosedive. No more bank loans, government permits, study or career opportunities for me, please! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 1 week ago Social credit score doesn't apply to regular people in the PRC. It's for corporations and sometimes politicians. https://youtu.be/wYaKoDyIvWA permalink fedilink source parent
[–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 1 week ago Social credit score doesn't apply to regular people in the PRC. It's for corporations and sometimes politicians. https://youtu.be/wYaKoDyIvWA permalink fedilink source parent