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BYD opens Denza Z9S pre-orders, claiming the 'world's longest' EV range at 1,100 km (electrek.co)
submitted 3 months ago by to c/electricvehicles@slrpnk.net
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[–] 23 points 3 months ago (24 children)

EV range is a fossil fuel funded fear monger.

A house with solar or wind will almost always have the ability to charge stuff, because of the excess. So unless you have a daily commute of over 300km, apart from a few super cheap options, range isn’t even a thing, as you’ll leave with 90% battery every morning from your house.

Roadtrips? Plan them around charging points and do something fun. Who wants to sit in a car for over 3 hours non stop anyway?

What’s that? You want to go offroading and decide in the moment and have options? Yes, remind me who started blasting those type of commercials around the time EVs became popular? Even still, cybertruck’s second hand appreciation should drop below $10k soon.

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  • [–] 6 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    It’s never about range. People who want fossil fuel cars will always find a reason to use one.

    It’s about maintaining their own personal status quo, it has nothing to do with practicality.

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  • [–] 7 points 3 months ago (5 children)

    People drive long distances to get places, not for fun. I drove home from an event earlier this year and sat on the interstate for hours without stopping. I don't want to stop and wait, i don't want snacks, i even avoid stopping for reatroom breaks. my guess is that i went 4hrs without stopping and only then stopped to pee. It was ~6.5hr drive in total.

    It's a legitimate critique.

    Yes, we could all charge our phones every time we sit down but we want bigger batteries so that we don't have to.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    I hear you, and I’m equally certain that with a bit better planning, not all that much inconvenience, you could have ever so slightly adapted or adjusted your journey. Leave earlier, later, bring a laptop for work. It is just a mindset switch (which is probably just as hard as deciding to stop smoking or eating junk food) where once you’re in it, you understand how ridiculous it is that people don’t want to make the slightest bit of adaptation for a tiny contribution to a better environment and to get off this oil train.

    On a safety note: 4hrs is really not recommended, electric or not.

    On a medical note: holding your wee for that long may not be that healthy either.

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  • [–] 5 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    I don't plan my roadtrips. I have always just picked a direction and a goal (normally get to the in-laws in 3 days), and then when I got bored I looked for something to do. When the fuel tank got low I stopped at the next gas - which wasn't very far.

    Now that I have an EV it isn't that easy because even though chargers are all over, they are not on the main routes and not advertised. Thus I need a navigator to find them - if this is a solo road trip (which now that I'm married I no longer take) I'd have to pull off the road because you cannot find chargers without a phone (and cell signals which are not common in the places I drive, though I guess I can drive to the next town where there is both a signal and the next likely place to find a charger anyway)

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  • [–] 10 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

    Yup, the general distribution of charging networks and discoverability is my main problem, not necessarily the range itself.

    If I'm driving more than an hour and a half total, I know I'll need to find a charger somewhere on my route. Unlike gas stations, chargers are generally not advertised on informational signs, which is why I've bookmarked a number of chargers on my typical routes and started using plugshare for discovery on new routes.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    There are all kinds of gps apps that highlight charge stations, most EVs have then built in.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago

    I have found that the normal map applications I've used only highlight the large networks like Electrify America, EVGo, Chargepoint, etc. if they even have the functionality to show chargers in the first place. For example, google maps doesn't show many of the chargers I frequently use, like the Kwik Trip charging network. I've even tried to add them to the map but the changes have been rejected every time.

    The benefit of a standalone app like plugshare is that it's crowd-sourced and generally more up-to-date. People can add new stations as they come online regardless of network and leave reviews with helpful info like "charger #4 is broken" or "the charging cables are short, you might need to back in". For the larger networks, active capacity is also shared in the same way that google maps shows (e.g. 6/10 stations in use). It also lets me do route planning based on my expected range and save it for later or or open the route in my gps.

    To me, all that is way more useful than what I get out of the built-in google maps in my car, where the charger selection is limited and the gps will arbitrarily select chargers on my route if it's too long without giving me much choice in the matter.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Roadtrips? Plan them around charging points and do something fun. Who wants to sit in a car for over 3 hours non stop anyway?

    Found the european with 7 weeks vacation and dont have to worry about wasting a day sitting at charging points.

    But really, the amount of money saved from owning a cheap, short range ev could just be spent renting a car for a roadtrip. I could see the rental industry evolving to have people swap cars to continue on their journey.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

    I don't own a car. But I do occasionally rent one for trips crossing the US.

    There is a market for this, even if it's not the most common use case for most people who own cars.

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  • [–] -3 points 3 months ago (7 children)

    I just realized you said km not miles. 300km is marginal for useful EV range. You should charge to 80% for battery life. You should never get below 20% - this is an emergency buffer to use if there is a real emergency which few people have but you should be prepared for anyway. Now cut what is left in half because it gets to -25 in winter and you need heat. Your 300km is now under 100km which is easy to do in a busy day when you have any after work hobby.

    Sure in the best case 300km is more than enough, but everything above is real world typical worst case that everyone I know hits. Maybe you live in a mild climate where you can ignore the cold range hit but I don't.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago (6 children)

    Found the paid by BP account.

    Also did you just mix km with ºF? You absolute monster!

    Large batteries can be charged up to 90% for daily commuting. Once a month it is good to charge up to 100% anyway, and that can be for your road trip.

    It would be hard to find a modern EV that struggles getting you more than 150~200km of effective range if you plan for it and respect buffers.

    I find it hilarious that these range anxiety people are so scared to wait for a 15~30min top up while they easily waste that time scrolling on their phone a multiple of that every day.

    Not having the insane energy density of fossil fuels, forcing you to pause life for just a coffee break, sounds exactly like the kind of thing humans need right now.

    Did you know you don’t have to hold and depress the nozzle or have to stay with your car while it is charging?

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Did you know you don’t have to hold and depress the nozzle or have to stay with your car while it is charging?

    You mean get out and walk around with my legs? I thought this was America!

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (3 children)

    I have a modern EV. I'm describing my reality. It has plenty of range for everything until it gets cold. that range is more than 300km, and it cannot do my regular trips when it is cold. I found this out the hard way last winter, and when I checked there was exactly one charger in range (I was visiting friends in a poor rural area well off the beaten path) - a level two charger that only gave a few km per hour meaning I needed a long lunch someplace where I didn't want to be just to get enough range to get home. At least nothing went wrong because I was well under that 20% buffer when it was deadly cold outside.

    At -25 the difference between C and F a rounding error. Which is why I didn't specify units.

    Pretending EVs have no flaws is not helpful. I won't too back, but in not blind to the flaws. Maybe your reality is different but you are not everyone.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago* (2 children)

    China is already selling cars with sodium batteries for this issue.

    Good to -40C. Lithium ranges are typically half in cold weather.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (1 child)

    They exist, but they are not yet generally available in the real world. We can ignore them today, but who knows what next year will bring. When I know I will change my position.

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