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Russia’s Olympic ban lifted (www.telegraph.co.uk)
submitted 4 months ago by to c/world@lemmy.world
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[–] 134 points 4 months ago (75 children)

Bare minimum they should be made to stop genociding before they're allowed back in.

Russia, Israel and China should all be treated the same.

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  • [–] 74 points 4 months ago (44 children)

    Russia, Israel and China should all be treated the same.

    Sure. The same as America.

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  • [–] 17 points 4 months ago (42 children)

    The Russia, Israel and China are all doing their genocides on a scale far bigger than what USA is currently doing.

    Therefore, be careful not to make it look like "these don't need to excluded because USA isn't". Perfect is the enemy of good!

    But otherwise I do agree: USA has no place in any international sports events as long as its behaving like the ass it's been for at least the past 50 years.

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  • [–] 29 points 4 months ago (7 children)

    I'm sure Cuba thinks the blockade on it is totally fine and doesn't constitute a similar crime like Israel withholding aid to Palestinians. Or attacking a sovereign state and kidnapping it's leader. Or attacking a sovereign state and killing multitudes of civilians. And that's just the past year.

    I agree Russia, China, Israel bad - but to think the US isn't so fucking far up there with them, not just now but historically, is really not giving enough "credit" where it's due.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 months ago

    Nope, it's a blockade - the US seizes vessels that try to trade with Cuba. That's why it's been such big news. Have you been living under a rock?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/20/world/americas/cuba-oil-blockade-trump.html

    The U.S. military has seized ships that have supported Cuba. And in recent days, vessels roaming the Caribbean Sea in search of fuel for Cuba have come up empty or been intercepted by the U.S. authorities.

    While President Trump has pledged to halt any oil headed to Cuba, the Trump administration has stopped short of calling its policy a blockade.

    But it is functioning as one.

    At the same time, the largest U.S. military presence in the Caribbean in decades is policing the waters around the island, fresh off its work blocking oil shipments to and from Venezuela ahead of the U.S. capture of the country’s leader, Nicolás Maduro, last month.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago

    Apart from the other answer talking about the very recent escalation, which is a physical blockade to completely starve the island, about the embargo itself: it has been voted on several times in the UN in order to stop it, but it’s always being vetoed by USrael. It’s a grave human rights violation with the explicit aim to cripple the small island in every dimension. How does the embargo actually work? It‘s not really true, that it‘s not preventing other countries from trading with Cuba, as the reality looks like this: every company that trades with the tiny island will be barred from trading with the world‘s superpower USA. Guess what happens? Almost no company does actively trade with Cuba, as it would automatically lose access to the huge US market. It‘s an economic blockade to actively prevent Cuba from developing.

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    1- I'm not comparing, there's no comparison of a decades long genocide. I'm drawing a parallel that blockading of civilian used goods for an entire population is inherently evil/bad. It didn't all of a sudden become evil post-2023.

    2- it's not a "counter-argument". Someone made an opinion statement, not an argument, and I am making the argument.

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  • [–] 11 points 4 months ago (8 children)

    So we can do genocide as long as it's only a little genocide?

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago (7 children)

    That wasn't a defense of the US. It was pointing out that while the US is bad, others are worse. They even closed out saying they agree US shouldn't be allowed in internationally competition. Nobody should be genociding, some are genociding harder than others, all should be banned.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    It wasn't my claim, but I would imagine OP maybe referring to the active Uyghur and Turkic Muslim genocide. The US government and by proxy the military commit numerous atrocities. The most recent action in Iran being extremely relevant. As bad as those acts are, imo they still fall short of what Russia, Israel, and China are doing. Again, not a defense of the US, just my opinion on how those 4 nations stack up. And to reiterate, all should be banned from international events like the Olympics.

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  • [–] 23 points 4 months ago (10 children)

    The Russia, Israel and China are all doing their genocides on a scale far bigger than what USA

    American Exceptionalism strikes again.

    You've got Americans blowing up hospitals and daycares in Iran, shooting up fishing boats off the coast of Venezuela, sieging Cuba to the point of mass starvation, and facilitating genocides from Libya to Afghanistan. But the pre-programmed western response is "I think the other countries are worse!" That's all that matters. You heard the other guys were worse.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    I don't know if it's American Exceptionalism in this case so much as a failure to adjust to current year. That argument could have been made with obama-era Amereica but not today.

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  • [–] 8 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    That argument could have been made with obama-era Amereica

    Barack Obama Is A War Criminal

    During his presidency, Obama approved the use of 563 drone strikes that killed approximately 3,797 people. In fact, Obama authorized 54 drone strikes alone in Pakistan during his first year in office. One of the first CIA drone strikes under President Obama was at a funeral, murdering as many as 41 Pakistani civilians. The following year, Obama led 128 CIA drone strikes in Pakistan that killed at least 89 civilians.

    ...

    The drone operations extended to Somalia and Yemen in 2010 and 2011, resulting in more destructive results. Under the belief they were targeting al-Qaida, President Obama’s first strike on Yemen killed 55 people including 21 children, 10 of which were under the age of five. Additionally, 12 women, five of them pregnant, were also among those who were murdered in this strike. These blundered acts of murder by not only President Obama, but the U.S. government, are morally reprehensible.

    Even more civilian casualties came out of Afghanistan throughout Barack Obama’s time in office. In 2014, Obama began removing troops currently deployed in the country. However, instead of this action by the president being one in a pursuit of peace and stability in the region, it only acted as an opportunity to drastically increase air warfare. Afghanistan had war rained upon them by U.S. bombardment, with the administration viciously dropping 1,337 weapons on Afghanistan in 2016. In total that year, the Obama administration dropped 26,171 bombs (drone or otherwise) across seven countries: Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Yemen, Somalia and Pakistan. The U.S., in cooperation with its allies including the Afghan government, killed 582 civilians on average annually from 2007 to 2016.

    ...

    With the exception of the wars themselves, the claim that former President Barack Obama is a war criminal also lies within the double-tap initiative. Double-tap drone strikes are as disturbing as they sound; these attacks are follow-up strikes on first responders as they rush to the bombed area trying to assist any survivors. In 2012, an attack on the Shawal Valley aimed at Taliban commander Sadiq Noor reportedly killed up to 14 people in a double-tap drone strike. These attacks are both morally and legally reprehensible, as they are conscious acts of murder against civilians.

    So much of what Obama presided over was an extension of the Bush, Clinton, and Reagan policies which were themselves extensions of our wars in Vietnam and Korea. What separates Obama from Trump largely boils down to volume. But the policies were no different than Putin's illegal actions in Crimea and Chechnya. Or Netanyahu's engineered famine in Gaza and the West Bank.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    yeah, what a lot of statesians fail to gather is that regardless of how our internal politics change depending on which party is in power, our international politics are generally consistent.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    60%+ of Americans opposed aid to Israel during the height of their genocide, and I think 55%+? oppose the war with Iran.

    It's not a true democracy (or a true republic). It's an oligarchy with a democratic theater routine which is adequately convincing to distract the majority of the undereducated public.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    Facts don’t care about your "I think"s. Your “I think” is an opinion.

    Opinions the heuristics one uses when exposed to incomplete data.

    Destroying 1000 daycares is worse than destroying 100 daycares.

    Throwing out a bigger number based on the allegations of serial liars is fact-based. And continuing to trust the allegations of an organization that would flatten 100 daycares on a whim is an error in judgement.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago* (5 children)

    The Russia, Israel and China are all doing their genocides on a scale far bigger than what USA is currently doing.

    Where, exactly, do you think Israel's money and weapons and bombs come from?

    Also, add (US Ally) Saudi Arabia to the genocidaire list, given their sponsorship of the RSF.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    Yes, it is, in my morality. You are not the arbiter of morality.

    There's a reason why, in regular civilian law, someone who takes out a hit is viewed as equally culpable as the actual hitman.

    Also Russia gets its money from selling gas to the EU, right? And the EU would freeze without Russian gas? It's a bad situation but not equivalent to US dumping money into the fake Zionazi state solely for their shared imperial aims.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (2 children)

    EU gets something like 5 % of its gas from the Russia. It used to get about two thirds, but that was changed during 2022 and 2023, and now our gas comes from other sources by ships.

    But there's still much oil that we either allow to pass through our waters on ships that are not in the condition to traverse them legally, or by outright buying the oil through some intermediaries.

    And then there are a lot of companies that merrily operate in the Russia. First two companies to come to my mind that have expanded their activities in the Russia when other companies left it, are Pepsi and Nestlé, and while neither of those is from the EU, they are good examples of what is going on. The billions that Pepsi alone pays in taxes in the Russia are extremely necessary for the Russian war effort.

    And in one thing you are wrong: A murderman's landlord does not get the same punishment as the murderman, even if he has had a strong hunch that his tenant might be up to no good.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (1 child)

    Pepsi has oddly had ties to Russia forever, and as a result, briefly had the world's six-largest Navy. Mostly obsolete shit-ships that were sold for scrap, so "superpower" in the headline is misleading, but "6th largest maritime fleet at the time" is accurate.

    Anyway, capitalism is evil and major corporations are evil, and their CEOs and chief stakeholders should be tried for crimes against humanity in many cases. You'll find no argument from me there.

    But EU businesses (none of which you were even able to name as chief contributors) doing business with Russia does not seem remotely equivalent to the actual government of the United States providing weapons, logistical support, and in some cases, boots-on-the-ground for the Zionazi entity's holocaust against Palestine.

    For the reference, I'm American, I have no vested interest in arguing in defense of Europe lol. It's just what I see as the truth.

    And in one thing you are wrong: A murderman’s landlord does not get the same punishment as the murderman, even if he has had a strong hunch that his tenant might be up to no good.

    Good thing that's a completely inapplicable analogy then. A landlord doesn't usually pay their tenant's rent, and self-defense budget, and healthcare bills, and...

    Israel is not America's tenant, it is America's child. Or if you prefer, a metastasized cancer from the same malignant source: white supremacy, colonialism, and capitalism.

    Anyway, even if you somehow refuse to condemn the American Empire for their clear complicity in Pissrael's ongoing genocide, America itself was founded on genocide on a scale greater than most other genocides being named here. And they still profit from it, and still have not paid reparations for it, and still have the remaining descendants of the victims largely living in poor conditions.

    On that note, add Belgium to the list too.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Anyway, even if you somehow refuse to condemn the American Empire for their clear complicity in Pissrael’s ongoing genocide

    I absolutely do, though. It is inacceptable. (It is also inacceptable that also Finland seems to be supporting Israel more than it supports Palestine. And especially Germany's support for the genocide is horrible. They should know better! But USA is being far worse in this regard than anything in EU)

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (6 children)

    Pffft 8000 civilians killed in Iran together with their entire government doesn't even count.
    That's within u/Lehmuusa's acceptable limits. Invading and kidnapping the leader of Venezuela under false pretense is just another day of the month, and blockading and starving a country for oil for no reason is just an example of how might makes right.

    AFAIK we do not have verification that more than 8000 Uighurs died, so it seems to me that USA deserves to be on that list not less but MORE than China. Also I haven't heard about China bombing girls schools.

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  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago* (4 children)

    we do not have verification that more than 8000 Uighurs died

    The big difference between the Chinese War on Terror in Xinjiang and the American War on Terror in North Africa, the Middle East, and Central Asia is that Hu Jintao (he was The Good One, can't speak ill of Hu) Xi Jinping did it using the Dark Arts of Communism rather than the Liberty-imbued Democracy Bombs of Capitalism.

    Therefore, every Uighur killed in a police raid on a mosque or who died in a detention camp in Loupu is worse than any ten an American killed with a Shock And Awe bombing run or tortured to death at Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo Bay.

    So that 8,000 is closer to 80,000. And when you use the Black Book of Communism math to count the unborn decendents of those dead Muslims (whom we love, because Americans universally condemn all forms of Islamophobia and embrace all religions equally) we're talking about 800,000. Maybe even 8M. Certainly possible it's more than that, depending on which libertarian think tank or AI chatbot is running the numbers.

    Also I haven’t heard about China bombing girls schools.

    China has killed more than 100 Million Muslim Girls. Adrian Zenz told me so.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Just because you agree with the state sponsoring the genocide it doesn't make the genocide okay.

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  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago

    The bare minimum should be to have no Olympic Games. It's ultranationalist propaganda, and a cursory glance at the Wikipedia articles on the first and second World Wars should be sufficient to convince oneself it's a bad idea to promote the idea that nation states should compete against one another as adversaries.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 months ago (15 children)

    Why not USA too?

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  • [–] 10 points 4 months ago (9 children)

    lol you mean other than the ones we keep bombing and the ones we keep letting our allies bomb?

    not counting those, America hasn't genocided in years. At least three.

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    We have deliberately killed civilians in every conflict Trump has engaged in.

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  • [–] 14 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    If we expand to concentration camps, we can add at least USA, France (I guess all of Europe contracting with other countries to handle migrants) that I know off. And I think that Canada does not really care about its native people when they go missing, so we could add it to.

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  • [–] 19 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    That comment kind of seems to distract from the genocides and that kind of minimizes them no?

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago

    We're rounding up non-whites and sending them to concentration camps to die. We have an entire organ of state devoted to ethnic cleansing. USAID cuts alone put our regime among the top fascists by bodycount.

    I don't anyone looks better by being put in the same category as the US.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago

    It was not my intention. I wanted to add that we should stop at the early signs of horror, and add some shitty countries to the list too.

    In the case of France, we have frontex as a member of the EU, and they published a nice little book for kids about their expulsion and how it is only a trip back :) or our CRA (Centre de rétention Administratif) which are nothing else that concentration camp, where you are locked up without judgement, doctors can't come in and you can spend years in worse conditions than our already bad prisons, before being deported back to "your country". And children gets in CRA too.

    I wanted to emphase on these country have issue with human rights, but our white countries too.

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