Do you want authoritarianism, because that’s how you get it.
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The elites in every country are fighting together to keep us down, while we fight against each other.
There is a simple common problem.
Why does every government want age verification now, what's in it for them? Can't be one started and everyone saw it and thought that's a great idea let's introduce it too?
Because it de facto requires everyone using the internet to provide their identity, which is something that gives authoritarian types a huge boner. Once there is no such thing as anonymous discourse, it becomes trivial to target/arrest/harass/brutalize dissenters or indeed anyone the current regime simply doesn't like.
This amount of surveillance has a really disturbing track record in history. So assuming any politician backing this must be a fascist at heart is the correct approach. These politicians should not be in any position to make any of these decisions. They can't represent democracy when they declare themselves the enemies of it.
It gives any gov a huge boner, not just athoritarians, that's the real problem.
It’s part of the data center push, Palantir, all of it. Centralized info storage so if anyone starts to push back anywhere they know exactly who and where. That and ads. The internet is too anonymous.
It’s the same set of billionaires. A little line between countries doesn’t mean much to them.
It's so blatant too, for anyone with half a brain. We're part of 5 Eyes, there's like 97 data centres being built or already in the late stages of approval here, and all of our internet traffic is controlled by 3 mega ISPs in moustache and glasses. We're already being tracked pretty thoroughly. Conservatives or Liberals, it doesn't matter when it comes to selling Canadians off to foreign corporate entities.
Because the wealthy and the elite think we are on the cusp of a world with a massive labor surplus, no jobs, and nothing to follow it. There will be massive unrest, and so they want to lockdown the internet before that happens, so it will be easier to direct the angry horde at each other rather than at the top where all the issues are actually stemming from.
Social networks see the writing on the wall and want to create regulatory capture. If they provide the identify verification it is another hook into us.
I suspect it's just their way of inching towards requiring everyone to provide ID to access the internet, they pretty much always wrap this stuff up in some sort of "protect the children" hysteria, so they can accuse anyone who protests it of being a pedophile.
Also Meta is lobbying for it so they can get off the hook for having to moderate their own stuff by shunting the responsibility onto someone else.
What can we do to stop this?
My plan is to just never submit to an age verification. Change servers or self host if necessary. Worse comes to worse, we log off.
That's the spirit.
I'll watch the system burn to the ground before I agree to privacy invasion.
But it won't burn, it will be content to leave you behind.
And so what? Many of us left Reddit because it killed 3rd party apps to force us onto its shitty mobile app. Did it burn without us? No, I doubt they even noticed. Does that make our departure meaningless? Also no, we built something better here.
So it isn't a choice between privacy invasion or watching it burn. It's a choice between privacy invasion and being left behind.
Left behind? If you've deemed a system to be so necessary that refusing to abandon your privacy at its behest means you are condemned to live in obsolescence, then you're only reinforcing the idea that we must surrender our rights for the benefits of the system.
I'm old enough to have lived in a world without the internet and if it's going in a direction that demands I surrender my right to privacy then I'll return to a life without the internet. I won't be alone and just like Lemmy I'm confident we'll build an alternative that aligns with our values.
I have serious doubts that returning to a ludite existence is truly feasible anymore. These companies, along with governments, seem intent on making it a necessity to be online and to do so without privacy.
The CEO of nvidea outright said their plans for the future involve AI agents accessing your financials and PCs being replaced with AI boxes as our interface. If they force AI into enough stuff before the bubble bursts, it won't be a choice. The way the net works will be built for AI, not for users to manually interface with. If the infrastructure is rebuilt for AI, it won't be a choice. With governments all pushing for OS level Id, Microsoft trying to record all user action, the push to ban VPNs, it seems like you will be making that choice sooner than you want.
I hope it works out for you but anyone who remembers a pre-internet life is middle age now and isn't the target market for emerging tech anymore. If AI proves to be significantly advantageous, not being online to sue it will be like refusing to use computers was to the boomers. You'll be outcompeted and lose track of how the world is changing.
You are missing the most important part - no matter who says what, people are still here.
We build the web, we make the food, we build houses. That doesn't go away.
Sure but we build them on the orders of whoever signs our paychecks so we can stay alive. People fuck each other over at their jobs every single day by helping companies succeed at their ambitions. Theoretically we have power in numbers but we rarely even actually use that power.
Sounds like you're trying your hardest to convince yourself that it's worth selling your soul for whatever they're offering. If that's the case then they've already won and it's only a matter of time before your freedoms are stripped away and you willfully become a virtual slave for fear of missing out on whatever prosperity is being promised.
These are the challenges we face, it doesn't serve anything to pretend they don't exist.
What are you even talking about? If anybody is denying the existence of a challenge, it's you through your insistence that there is no future worth living without the unrelenting integration and consumption of technology.
Don't get me wrong, I rely on these technologies as much as the next. In fact, as a software engineer, it's my livelihood and I'm going to support any means to keep it aligned with my own values.
But I also recognize that I am a small fish in a vast ocean and that my most reliable weapon against tyranny is my own free will. If push comes to shove then I can and will simply refuse to follow society into the techno-feudalist hellscape we're moving towards.
You call it being left behind; I call it liberation.
I wish I was lucky enough to grow up in those times. Recently a mother almost lost custody of her kid because he was outside on his own.
TBH this is just how it goes in general I think. A small group of people build something neat, and if it attracts enough people then the corporations and money come in, they attract more people and it all goes to shit, then a small amount of people from that group leave and start a new thing. reddit was the neat little alternative thing once.
I suspect eventually we'll probably have to build a second internet lol
Oh I left Reddit because they permabanned me for something that wasn’t even violent and the platform is built specifically to make it hard to appeal and they don’t even give you warning like “take this down or we’ll ban you” you just comment and a few minutes later your account is lost to the ether.
God I hate that place so much.
They did you a favor. It happened to me maybe a month ago and I'm not missing it. I was pretty much down to using one sub only by the time it happened, though, so YMMV I suppose.
Yeah the only problem I have is that there are very few posts here and the communities have far fewer people. Reddit isn’t like TikTok how it can be pretty much replaced by IG reels or YT shorts, since it’s really unique with its content and community.
That said, every Reddit moderator is a fatass with a kink for how their own armpits smell
And what do you do when its a requirement to buy food, submit tax returns, get healthcare?
This is the problem people don’t understand. We have the same issue now in the UK. People think a voluntary system is easy ro just ignore until everything you rely and need forces you to starve or submit.
And its not going to stop at just age verification, it’ll continue until all you get to enjoy is maybe a loaf of bread, and some pond water! 🤦♂️
I might be mistaken, but I don't think a government can force it's citizens to have a phone. There has to be a way to pay your taxes, buy stuff, etc that doesn't rely on you having a phone. Paper money still exists after all.
It might be possible to live disconnected rather than giving away your privacy. You'll have to say goodbye to social media, but I don't see it as a bad thing.
Why wouldn't it be able to? That's just a matter of which laws are enacted. And considering government is responsible for proposing and enacting laws, well..
I’m planning on phoning and irritating people. I make it as awkward as possible. Sorry I have a dumb phone….no worries our staff can process your info…asks 50 questions about privacy….i see them getting pissed off. Ensures to give them my details and I will be making sure they wipe them afterwards due to eu laws.
The impact that may have on navigating life seems significant. Have you even considered how that would actually work? Practically.
For who? Where? I'm what?
Voting won't do shit, the majority of people don't even see the problem with these bills.
And that defeatist mentality is the reason shit doesn’t change.
Vous avez beau ne pas vous occuper de politique, la politique s'occupe de vous tout de même
(You might not care about politics, politics will take care of you nonetheless)
End capitalism. It's no coincidence all these countries are pushing this in lockstep.
End goal is the death of online freedom.
Get angry, get involved in your local politics to bring democracy to the workplace and the economy.
It's not gonna get better otherwise.
Its unlikely that we will, too many people want this and the elites have created a system that has disempowered people completely. You work around it, with VPNs and use other sites.
Stop voting “strategically” and stop whining about largely made-up NDP critiques. People will voluntarily eat shit just because they heard that the cake on offer doesn’t have any icing.
Those in power hate the anonymous internet.
This seems rather pointless from a business standpoint it will hurt many businesses geared towards children such as youtube kids even.
I think anyone thinking about enacting a law like this deserves to be impeached immediately the public have spoken against this and they are more valid arguments than for this.
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Your ID data can be hacked such as what happened with persona. I don't consider uploading your ID unless you must for a bank, phone provider, government entity, or work. No other business should ever need this info in my opinion.
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Selfie option will just fuel artificial intelligence. In my opinion they need to outlaw the use of scrapping age verification selfie images for ai.
If I hear anything else about C-34 I'm going to slap the benzos out of Jordan Peterson
Rule34: don't lock down the Internet
How many lawmakers are publicizing their support for Rule 34 on the internet?
Rule 34 is a famous internet maxim stating: "If it exists, there is porn of it. No exceptions." It asserts that any conceivable subject, fictional character, corporate brand, or inanimate object has been or will be depicted in explicit content somewhere online.
Serious question, can we start building local infrastructure for our own internet via meshtastic and those technologies?
You should check out reticulum if you haven't already. More use cases than just messaging.
We're not already doing that? (No we're not, my node is hella lonely)
Seconding reticulum. Meshtastic is a toy, reticulum is actual infrastructure
Yes. Liberals aren't your friends. They appropriated queer politics to do exactly this. People have been warning against this for decades.
They are not being tricked into doing this, this is the second time the Liberal party alone has tried this along with other proposals from Cons and other internet authoritarianism policies like lawful access. They know what it is for and they understand the consequences of who it'll effect. It just so happens queer people (racialized people, indigenous people, disabled people, etc.) are also disproportionately politically active and challenging to liberal capitalism, and liberals have had an exceedingly difficult time shutting that down online through censorship alone.
It is not only distortive but also dangerous to accept that this is out of stupidity and ignorance. They are attacking us. "Elbows up," awards for the people who voted for Carney because they didn't think a minority govt with a stronger NDP presence was possible.
I mean I agree with you mostly but the vote was for Carney or conservatives. Voting NDP for most people would be effectively a vote for the Tories.
Two generational NDP ridings in my area flipped Con because of Liberal voters. So, I can't say I particularly give a shit about how this would hypothetically empower the PC Party, since our local needs will definitely be ignored in the foreseeable future anyway, maybe forever if a Lib gets elected next. The fact is that a minority government, either PC or Liberal, would have far less power at its disposal to enact these common neoliberal policies. Instead, "Elbows Up," we have a majority Liberal parliament that is aggressively slashing environmental protections, funnelling public wealth into private corporations for "sovereignty-"based mining and fossil fuel drilling, and implementing authoritarian internet surveillance policies; of course, all without consideration of indigenous peoples or First Nations. Wow, what a difference.
Don't act like you're considering the trans genocide rhetoric that PP was running on either, because it's not like Carney has done anything to address the spread of anti-trans hatespeech or the restricted access to gender-affirming care achieved through privatization. Is it better because now it isn't talked about at all besides by the victims?
You do not have a two party system, you have a parliamentary system.
That's correct, thanks for telling me something I learned in grade 2 social studies.
I also learned what first past the post voting was in grade 2 social studies.
Cool, well, maybe you should read about it in your adult life too.
Thanks yeah I have, that's why I didn't throw my vote away giving it to the guy definitely coming a distant 3rd place and risking a Tory winning
Go learn the history behind our healthcare system. They don't need to form a govt in order to be effective. Everyone else understands what FPTP is and how Liberals weaponize anxiety over it by presenting themselves as some alternative to the Cons when they're functionally identical; especially in this case. You learned a single thing about this system and think that makes you smarter than everyone else. People make different decisions from you even with the same or more knowledge than you.
People like this are why neolibs have successfully gutted every social welfare system across this country.
Cool, FPTP in Parliamentary systems does not result in a two party system. Therefore no, your generic Americanism of 'if you don't vote for the lesser evil you're voting for the greater evil' is objectively and totally incorrect in every possible interpretation of Canadian politics or parliamentary politics in general.
I know you people are basically more American than European, but that doesn't meant you have to keep yourselves at their intelligence level.
You're really going to try to talk to me about my own political system and call me America for not knowing better?
It's you who doesn't understand our system, and I never mentioned once a two party state.
We are not a two party state, I don't like the liberals, and the only thing I said was that An NDP vote in most ridings for our last election would be in effect a vote in favor of the Tory in that riding. As in most ridings the liberals were the most likely to beat the Tories.
We need to vote strategically in our system of we don't want to throw away our votes or support Tories.
That's the reality of our system, I'm not that interested in the fantasy version where we vote NDP and then everyone gets a rainbow and a family doctor and an education
It’s you who doesn’t understand our system, and I never mentioned once a two party state.
Yes, yes you did. You said:
and the only thing I said was that An NDP vote in most ridings for our last election would be in effect a vote in favor of the Tory in that riding. As in most ridings the liberals were the most likely to beat the Tories.
This is a two party system that you're describing.
This is not what you have. A vote for a party is a vote for that party (or coalition). It is not a vote for whom you believe is the enemy party because its not for your preferred party.
Americans use the exact same reasoning, which resulted in the last two presidents having approval ratings under 40% within 2 years. "If you don't vote for 'shitty compromise which is objectively as bad as this other party but marginally different, you're just voting for the other party.'
We need to vote strategically in our system of we don’t want to throw away our votes or support Tories.
No. You have a parliamentary system. This is specifically designed to not devolve or degenerate into a two party system via 'strategic' aka American-style voting decisions. You vote for what you want. The more parties that win seats, the less power any party has, and the need for coalitions increases, which results in a better outcome than the American-style system you're ascribing to Canada.
You have the solution to two-party politics. You have the solution to strategic voting. It's already implemented. You just need to not ruin it by doing American-style politics. That's it.
That’s the reality of our system, I’m not that interested in the fantasy version where we vote NDP and then everyone gets a rainbow and a family doctor and an education
No, if everyone voted for the party that most represented their interests, then no single party has power and a coalition will have to form to produce a PM. Then you get a half rainbow, a chiropractor, and free American college; which is a half measure but infinitely better than sabotaging yourself because you think this is a team sport.
Thanks for confirming you truly don't understand our politics or system at all.
Assume I want to vote for party A, party B is acceptable to me, party C is unacceptable to me.
Polling shows party B and C are virtually neck and neck, party A is unlikely to win.
I vote for party B, party B wins, we get a chiropractor.
I vote for party A, party C wins, and we get fascism.
Explain to me why I should take a principled stance and vote A anyway. After all they're who I most want to vote for
Because if you vote for Party A and x number of people vote for party A, Party A gets x number of seats. You have a parliamentary system. Seats are awarded based on the percentage of votes. You vote for Party B Party A gets fewer seats, you are awarding mediocrity. If Party A and B are actually similar, then they will form a coalition and simply out number Party C making Party C unable to do anything.
You do not have a two party system. You have a Parliamentary system. You do not have a winner take all zero sum system, you have a parliamentary system.
Ahahaha. Thank you.
Yes, we do have a parliamentary system. No, seats are not awarded based on % of the vote. That's literally what I've been trying to tell you.
We do not have any form of proportional representation. We do not award any seats based on vote totals or %. We have a representative elected for each riding decided on first past the post basis.
That means in every riding there is 1 winner whether there are 2 parties or 15 parties running for that seat, and if you live in that riding and vote based on your feelings instead of strategically, you split the vote.
In any individual riding if the Tories win 35%, liberals 34%, NDP, 31% the Tories win that riding and have 1 seat in parliament. The liberals and NDP get nothing.
This repeats over every riding in the country and you get a house that's 100% Tory despite winning barely more than a third of the vote while libs and new Dems account for 2/3ds.
Are you finally ready to admit that you have no fucking idea how Canada works
Down voting me doesn't make FPTP not real
I love how you made this comment within minutes of someone else giving you a single downvote. You are wrong because you misunderstand how power in this system works and how people who aren't in positions of power must navigate the politics of this system to their benefit, not because people think that FPTP isn't a real thing or a factor in elections here.
I'm still not wrong. For most people in Canada Voting NDP in the last election would effectively have amounted to a pro Tory vote in the majority of ridings
Fuckin' source?
What source do you want man? Like go to elections Canada and paruse.
You're the one talking like you fuckin know shit. Show us.
What is it you're expecting me to prove? We have first past the post voting with no proportional representation. That's just a fact
What an obnoxious fuckin dickhead. You've been talking about this shit and you've never so much as looked up what the results were and whether what you actually say is true?
I'm so fucking done with this moron, point proven.
I know what the results were, and I don't understand what anyone is expecting to be proved here. My only argument is that our system currently works the way it works, and that wanting it to work differently doesn't make it so.
What do you want me to say exactly? If someone votes for anyone other than the 2nd place candidate in any riding, during any election, whatever the circumstances, they effectively helped the winner win.
That's a fact of math.
No, but being wrong makes you wrong.
There is a world where the NDP is a viable candidate, and Layton proved that.
Absolutely there is, and I would have loved to have voted for a competent NDP candidate in my riding if they had any prayer of winning either my riding or doing anything meaningful at all on a federal level.
I'm still not wrong though.
You wishing the NDP could have run and won in any significant numbers and without risking a PP victory doesn't make it so, and people voting NDP just because they like NDP policy wouldn't have changed that
I honestly think that's just a bonus to them. They're doing it so they can link people's IDs to their online activity and we all get automatically Big brothered for the rest of time
Ironic that this is being pushed by "liberals". They don't even bother to live up to their own failing ideology anymore.

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