As tensions escalate between California and the Trump administration over immigration, another potential battlefront is emerging over taxes.

The spat began with reports that the Trump administration is considering cutting funding for California's university system, the largest higher education system in the nation with about 12% of all U.S. enrolled students.

In response, Gov. Gavin Newsom wrote Friday afternoon in a social media post that California provides about $80 billion more in taxes to the federal government than it receives in return.

"Maybe it's time to cut that off, @realDonaldTrump," Newsom said.

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[–] 167 points 1 year ago (17 children)

Holy fucking shit. I'm amazed, I was just saying the other day that this would eventually get into this point. Didn't think it'd be this week

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  • [–] 116 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    Fascism only has one speed: Blitzkrieg.

    Any other speed would be slow enough for people to have enough time to band together and organize a resistance to this horseshit.

    That's literally the only playbook. Break everything: Go fast. Hit people with so much horseshit they are still stuck trying to process the one from 2 weeks ago, because since then 5 other constitutional crisis' have happened and now they're deporting both of your neighbors.

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  • [–] 43 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    That's not really the case, though. This rise of fascism has been building for decades now. It's been a slow, steady, drip drip drip. Perhaps not so noticeable except from the outside - Americans are embedded in a pervasive atmosphere of propaganda. The Republicans have been getting more and more authoritarian over the years, more and more extreme, and the Democrats have been letting them. It's been more than four years since the last violent coup attempt, after all, and those were the same people behind this play.

    It's not progressing fast. You just haven't noticed its progress until now, when it's nearly done.

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  • [–] 46 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    We're not talking about the rise of fascism. It took decades for that to ferment in Germany and Italy as well.

    We're talking about when they seize power. Then they make their move.

    We're talking about the powergrab of fascists once they've laid the groundwork.

    That's the part they need to move lightning fast to achieve a result, before resistance can organize against them. That's the part in history we're at right now.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Tom8to, tom@to, IMO. The "groundwork-laying" is also a process of seizing power, there just aren't quite so many guns going bang.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    I think it could be just tom@o

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    America has been fascist since the early 1910s, busting unions and putting capital first. Then Banana Republics were formed because democracy got in the way. And then half of Africa was invaded with American bases and money in an effort to bring the scattered oil fields under American corporate control. And India lost tens of thousands of lives to an American corporate disaster and no one could challenge the super military force guaranteeing popular democracy around the world (except where people actually heeled business interests).

    America has been a fascist superpower for over a century. It's professional name is neoliberalism.

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    At this rate they'll be deploying the Marines to LA's streets by July!

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  • [–] 33 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Um aren't they doing this now?

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  • [–] 150 points 1 year ago

    In a shocking twist rural Californian conservatives now want to pay federal taxes.

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  • [+] 299 points 1 year ago (24 children)
  • [–] 98 points 1 year ago (18 children)

    I don't think there's really a way to do this, since federal taxes are paid directly to the fed without state involvement. This is just to poke the bear, which I am all for.

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  • [–] 44 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Good. Keep poking until he has a heart attack. If he recovers, rinse and repeat until we get it right.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    I’m all for it too, but keep in mind that successors to dictators are never better; only worse. It only ever gets worse.

    Hide your kids. Hide your couch!

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    This dictator is the leader of the GOP, a cult of personality. That's not easily replaced

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    This dictator is merely a puppet; plain and simple. The real Palpatine is someone else. Maybe it’s Putin, or maybe it’s Thiel. We haven’t gotten to that episode yet.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    But this puppet is who the cultists at the bottom support. They won't get their support for anyone else so easily, if they even need them at that point.

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  • [–] 40 points 1 year ago

    The hypothetical way to do it is severely penalize companies within California that pay federal tax. Make it so financially burdonsome they have to relocate or stop paying federal tax of their own accord. This is just what's been suggested before when this has come up.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

    I've been thinking about this, and I'm afraid I agree. I'm not sure how you could enforce this. Paying federal tax seems like a personal choice and the consequences would be felt by individuals (tax evasion charges, unless trump manages to get it treated as a terrorist act). I'd be interested to see if the state was actually offering to shield CA citizens from being arrested by federal agents or subpoenaed by federal courts.

    Also, for the most part the Fed already has our money, right? The majority of that federal tax is withheld from paychecks and goes directly to the Fed...

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    You can withhold paying your federal taxes from your paycheck. Most people don't because they don't want to get stuck with a big tax bill in April with no way to pay it if they spent that money or lost it on a bad investment. if enough people all did that at once, regardless of state, it could put a big financial burden on Trump. The government heavily relies on this steady source of income, and unless you make a lot of money, you are probably getting a federal return every year, which means you gave the U.S. Government an interest free loan of sorts.

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  • [–] 76 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    I'm not mad at this at all I'm thrilled a politician is actually fighting back. He has a history of standing up against trump and the gop status quo

    That said this is the first time there is any bite to it and the cynic/realist in me is saying it's cause he is gearing up for presidential nomination and election. I really hope he is not the Democrat choice.

    if the good wife/fight taught me anything the democrats already have someone picked out and priming public for it

    I just wish we had Bernie i wanna see that timline :'(

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  • [–] 57 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    I want the timeline where Carter won a second term and the Christian nationalists funding Reagan realized their plan didn't work and give up on it.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

    Or how about a timeline where we didn't immediately give up on Restoration Reconstruction after the Civil War

    EDIT: derp.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    i want the timeline where harris won lol

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Harris lost before she ran. Not that she was a strong candidate, but the Dems could have ran literal Jesus, Trump was going to come back either way as long as big money was in politics. Maybe if they ran someone who at least promised change, they could have staved off Trump for another 4 years. Would they have sentenced him in another 4 years? Would anyone been able to get people like Thiel and Musk out of politics?

    This will get worse before it gets better. I just hope most of it stays contained in the US.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Trump's health has been declining pretty rapidly, especially his mental health. I won't be surprised if he doesn't make it to the end of this term. And if he does I'm not sure he'd be mentally capable of running in 2028

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Unfortunately, they tend to try harder when it doesn't work the first time. The first attempts at the Prosperity Gospel, prior to WWII, were laughed off because it was so obviously self-serving to rich people. They kept at it until it stuck.

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  • [–] 134 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    If blue states were to band together and do this, it would bankrupt Trump’s fascist federal government pretty quickly. Maybe a blue state Articles of Confederation is in order.

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  • [+] 72 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago

    There's a bigger thing people tend to forget: shipping ports. There aren't a lot of natural harbors on the west coast of North America. California has three of them (LA, Long Beach, San Fransisco) and Washington has two (Seattle and Tacoma).

    Want to trade anything with the rest of the world? The east coast and Mississippi ports aren't going to cut it. Don't want to trade anything? The US economy just went into depression.

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    [–] 66 points 1 year ago

    What is a donor state?

    Indeed, cbsnews. What is a “donor state”?

    Maybe if you could use that term a few dozen more times, other outlets could pick it up and it would eventually back up into Fox News’ talking points where they’d have to either lie utterly, or risk their viewers’ comprehension that red states take money from blue states. Charity, let’s say. MAGA heads would temporarily be offline.

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  • [–] 63 points 1 year ago

    I'm not a fan of Newsom, but get it dude.

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  • [–] 62 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    I've been talking to alot of people about something like this. If CA didn't pay federal tax, and all of it went to state, CA would make more money. Don't want to incite insurrection...but I think we could do alright by ourselves if push came to shove.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    As someone living in California, I could certainly use some more money... Doesn't help my employer moved me here then reneged on my proposed salary. It's very hard to make it here, but ultimately worth it. For me anyhow.

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  • [–] 29 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Doesn’t help my employer moved me here then reneged on my proposed salary

    Look up "promissory estoppel."

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  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Holy shit this is immensely helpful for me right now, thank you so much. I actually have a meeting with the CEO this Friday about this while thing. I will be bringing this up. Thank you again, so much.

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  • [–] 26 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    You may want to have a quick consult phone call with a labor lawyer before then. The company has an HR and legal team they've already consulted.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago

    To add to that, just because they have legal council involved doesn’t mean that they’re not in the wrong and know it. You may just need to say the magic words to make them back down and a labor lawyer who understands your case will know what those words are.

    You obviously may keep working there if it gets resolved to your satisfaction, so the support of a lawyer will help you play it cool while you negotiate. It’s easier to just be pissed if you know you’re being wronged but don’t have the language to clearly articulate how.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Yeah, but just wait for when King Trump makes California pay tariffs to trade with the remaining states! He'll bleed CA dry!

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago

    Yeah he'd try, Smartiest Economier he is. interstate trade is generally critical, but a good chunk of agriculture in the U.S.A. is in CA (Powerd by water from the hoover, yes) throw in Silicon valley, Hollywood, and Napa, CA putting tarrifs on the U.S.A. would hurt too, maybe more.

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  • [–] 62 points 1 year ago

    MOTHERFUCKING DO IT

    Stop bending the knee to a felon rapist traitor who uses the military to assault American citizens.

    Stop providing welfare to failing red states who elect felon rapist traitors who target blue states.

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  • [–] 51 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I had the disolution of the US for 2035 with California being the first to leave... Fuckin speedrunners

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  • [+] 34 points 1 year ago (12 children)
  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Just join Canada. If you are willing to consider you aren't the center of the world, you are welcome.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    They will just flatten it with carpet bombs.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    California is unlikely to give up their nukes.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Educate me for a moment, are Nukes on a seperate grid by state?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    I didn't either. I meant are they seperate state by state like that where a state could threaten to use or withhold nukes as you were implying?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    They are controlled normally by the Department of Energy.

    But sesession would be a weird event, and many things would change. Physical location is not one of them. And the physical location of the place where the most advanced nuclear weapons are designed and built is in California.

    Would the physicists and engineers at Lawrence Livermore just pack up and leave? Or would they continue rolling out B.83s or something in between.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Even more weird possibilities: would the DoE forcibly relocate the physicists and engineers who do this work? Or would California step in and protect them? In any case I think the number of weapons that wind up under the control of the State of California would not be zero. The same goes for bombers, and missile systems, of which California has the most flexible examples.

    Sure, the production missile fleet is in Montana and N. Dakota, but those things are there to draw fire, not necessarily to be used. But Vandenberg and Edwards are in California. What happens to those?

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  • [–] 34 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    There is no way Newsom has this much balls. There is no way he could possible be this based.

    Right? Golly, I hope he proves me wrong.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I barely know anything about Newsom's track record, but based on the last few months dude has the biggest balls I've seen on any US politician in a long time.

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  • [–] 68 points 1 year ago

    CA is the forth largest economy; it would destroy the red state fuckheads if they stopped paying federal taxes. The rest of us follow suit and we defund the motherfuckers stinking up the government.

    If you are sending our military against OUR OWN FUCKING PEOPLE we should not be PAYING FOR IT. My taxes don't go to that fascist bullshit

    🖕🤬🖕 Fuck drumpf and every bootlicker that got him (probably illegally) elected

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  • [+] 32 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 26 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I would like to leave this here as a warning, because it seems relevant to me.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_fire

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago*

    The Reichstag Fire was most likely a false-flag that the Nazis used to consolidate power... They're waiting for something to pop off so they have an excuse for martial law or whatever. If it doesn't happen on its own, then they'll probably just do it themselves. Agents provocateur are the oldest trick in the book.

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  • While I agree, I think that's a better comparison to the LA protests and the National Guard being called in. An entire state government "going rogue" (and the support that they may or may not have from the other states) is in a whole other class, especially when you consider the legal framework that separates the powers of the state from the federal government. It's closer to Brexit than anything else, imo, but even that doesn't truly match up with the intricacies of the power struggle since the members of the EU have their own militaries instead of a unified military under the governance of a body separate from its member countries.

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