This instance has made me realize that I am an anarchist. What a strange world… No regrets, thank you guys.
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Me posting this meme with the full knowledge that it might make it to “All” and generate a shitshow of a comment section

Turn off your notifications mate. And don't return to the scene of the crime
posting anti-tankie and anti-electoralism stuff in an Anarchism comm is one of the easiest way to generate infinite salt.
Don't even have to be an anarchist, just have to have at least partial hearing and/or vision.
Not even. I’m deaf and have terrible vision. In fact I was functionally blind for 8 months. And I can still see it!
Okay, have to have at least partial use of at least one sense.
So basically not be in a deep coma? Because I don’t think there is a disability where you losing touch hearing sight and smell.
You'd have to get a bunch of ailments all at once. Deep coma is much simpler. Anyways, very obvious, most of us only, at most lack 1 or 2 senses. There's no excuses for any of us to not "see" any of this.
I was going to suggest "be awake" and then realised I had accidentally re-invented the term "woke"
People who think they're well informed because they scroll through lots of memes are deciding elections now, and look where we are.
Well, believing in things is alienating, and the work required to gebuinely identify your self interest is frustrating and hard.
So what else are they supposed to do?
Ngl this mene unnecesarily divides people more than anything.
No socialists and "tankies" I know IRL don't deny Uyghur genocide, general opinion is "Conflict between the Chinese government and Uyghur groups exist but US media exaggerates it for clickbait articles too."
Similar with Israel. Democrats mostly say "I hate the Iran's government for their legal system but still doesn't justify civilians dying." Nobody is congratulating Israel on "standing up for gay rights" or some shit.
Also ask the other group how they feel about global warming or education system sometime.
No socialists and "tankies" I know IRL don't deny Uyghur genocide, general opinion is "Conflict between the Chinese government and Uyghur groups exist
MLs in lemmy absolutely deny anything bad is happening to Uyghurs.
This isn't about IRL. This is about the disinformation that bad actors spread in online communities.
You also have a selection bias. You have friends with similar political views because you distance yourself from people you disagree with, either physically or just through avoiding "sensitive" topics. I've personally disconnected from some friends because they didn't like it when I brought up Biden's historic support of Israel. I still voted for him and Harris over Trump, but that wasn't good enough for them.
No socialists and “tankies” I know IRL don’t deny Uyghur genocide, general opinion is “Conflict between the Chinese government and Uyghur groups exist but US media exaggerates it for clickbait articles too.”
Socialists in real life? Probably not. Tankies? Yes. They all do.
we need to get more people off reddit and twitter and onto lemmy
Tankies: handing out "genocide denial" bans for calling Ukraine a genocide.
You can simultaneously condemn the invasion of Ukraine and understand that false claims of genocide are harmful against people suffering genocide
Russia has been credibly accused off displacing local populations, seizing homes, mass torture and sexual violence against civilians and abduction of children in occupied territories. There are numerous examples of Russian politicians stating openly that they seek to exterminate Ukrainian identity.
The only argument that Russia is not engaging in large scale genocide is that Ukraine has prevented them from doing so by force.
None of the instances of what you're claiming have been disproportionate compared to any modern conflict if you actually run the numbers, and if you compare to western-backed wars such as the invasion of Iraq, the numbers pale in comparison. War is horrifying, and you can heavily criticise the invasion of Ukraine, but calling it a genocide simply doesn't hold when you look at the numbers.
Your comment being a good example of tankies denying Ukrainian genocide.
Putin kills Ukrainian civilians, not because of their religion or genetics or culture but to terrorise them into submission so that they encourage their military to give up so that he gets to plunder their land and resources.
This is very different to the universally accepted definition of genocide as applies to The Holocaust, Rwanda, Cambodia.
Ireland is trying to get the ICJ to broaden the UN definition of genocide to include both the Ukraine and Gaza tragedies.
Idiots have decided the new definition of genocide is simply "when one side kills a bunch of people on the other side" and get angry when you point out how infantile that is.
Infantile indeed. The popularity of Marvel/DC movies is symptomatic.
It is the age of hyperbole and polarization. As if something is not a tragedy worthy of attention unless you can paint it as the worst thing ever.
And the solutions imagined are total fantasy. Jews aint leaving the Levant, neither are the Arabs.
I watched a BBC documentary which blew my mind recently, leaving no party looking clean in the Middle East conflict. Neither ProPal nor Zionist philosophy comes into it. The reality is too messy for the partisan minds: HyperNormalization: A Different Experience of Reality.
Being in my 60's it has been years since I saw something so challenging. Since this is an anarchist community this should appeal although it is not hopeful. More like an examination of organised Chaos.
Why do you bring up tankies? I'm not talking about any communist state, I'm talking about the proto-fascist, contemporary Russian republic, and explicitly said you can condemn it.
I'm once again asking liberals to join xiaohongshu and see the uighur culture being celebrated openly. Crossnational meetups with turkish people comparing turkish to ughric, large streetfestivals and so so many videos sharing the language, alphabet, cuisine, music, stories, attire all on a chinese app for chinese people. If nothing else learn about the culture that is supposedly being genocided from the uyghurs themselves.
Admittedly I don't use 小红书, so I don't know for sure, but it is the commercialised and commodified kind of culture?
Because I remember back when I was in China and visited the Tarim Basin it was quite harrowing. Hami and to a lesser extent Kashgar felt pretty hostile to Uighurs.
I, as a non-Han person, had to go in the non-Han line at the railway station. But unlike the non-white foreigners in the line, I was given a seat in the shade out of the 40+°C heat, and could use the water machine while I waited, unlike the locals.
I also saw all the Uighur girls at school with their shaved heads. People were scared, and the word for school, 学校, was treated with horror.
Maybe just an apatheid society, but the fact that sites of religious, cultural, and historical significance have been knocked down or turned into a tourist trap (Grand Mosque in Umruqi, the Mosque in Central Kashgar whose name I forgot), does seem the culture is being worn down.
Also saw the police beating people in Kashgar market to make sure they closed their shops at 7pm Beijing time, not 7pm Xinjiang time... Because all of China must be one time zone.
You'll also see other ethnicities costumes, and parades on social media. But they're not allowed to talk their languages at school and their festivals don't get to exist outside of being for tourists, and they don't get the leeway with laws than Han people do.
As expected, tankies came out in drove to whitewash Uyghur genocide 😂
There are far too many complaints and eyewitness to hide the grievances from the Uyghurs and CCP's mistreatment of them.
There is significant politicization of genocide declarations. They are all declared by fascist US empire and its slave controlled democracy colonies. There is very obvious extensive video evidence of extermination policies for Palestinians.
China responded to 2014 terrorist attacks with education and job creation programs. Xinxiang has had decent prosperity and population growth compared to other Chinese provinces despite a BDS policy from US controlled empire. The "technical genocide" accusation is based on a handful of Uyghur women with 4+ children who somehow all got to the UK, and claimed to now be sterile. Uyghurs had historically been exempt from Chinese one child policy.
Political demonism happens independently of facts. There are historical tensions in Xinxiang between Uyghur/muslim majority and relatively more prosperous Han minority, but Chinese policies are far more egalitarian than Alabama policies with much higher inequality. China has made the most humanist response to terrorism in history of civilization, even if it is not above criticism.
I would love a source on the Uyghurs that isn't Adrain Zenz. He is the* Fash behind the "Victims of Communism Memorial Fund".
All sources eventually point back to him in our Western Media, and its fucking disgusting.
(Edit: he is one of the Fash behind actual Nazi Propaganda Smuggling)
Interestingly Xinjiang's population growth since 2015 has been due to migration from the rest of China rather than birth rates, and the Uighur birth rate has fallen over this time period while the slackening of birth control legislation has led to slight increases (as compared to one child policy era) for the rest of non-Tibetan PRC.
The destruction of traditional life-styles and enforced capitalist Socialist (with Chinese Characteriatics) modernity with SOEs taking control of traditionally common or village wide croplands and flocks, in the 80s led to a lot of the economic problems in the first place. It's similar to enclosure in Europe, where now to not want to labour away in a factory for a wage and make your boss richer is extremism and also mad.
That is to say, I do not think the PRC is actively killing large amounts of Uighurs. But there is a policy of cultural erasure, commodifiction of culture and heritage, and very tight, apartheid style control of the population.
The UN, where the CCP has veto powers?
China doesn’t have veto power over the UN Human Rights Council, which voted to reject debating this any further, over 2½ years ago: https://xcancel.com/un_hrc/status/1578003299827171330
We don't allow Xitter links on on dbzer0, can you please change the link to https://xcancel.com/un_hrc/status/1578003299827171330 or a screenshot instead? Thanks
The US is not to be trusted and loves to manipulate the narrative. It's good to fact check it, as the US does not have the Uighur people's lived experience at heart.
Unfortunately, not does the PRC (and inviting journalists from friendly Muslim nations to talk to locals on camera to say everything is fine is one way to narrative shift and give a good media blitz). And while the PRC is probably not targeting Uighurs for organ harvesting any more than any other inmates in the prison system, it is a not a great situation for them there.
There are/were prison camps which provide "vocational training/reeducation". The many non-Han people of the area are clearly second class citizens, and their cultural spaces have been commodified and turned into tourist spots.
Edit: Bitter Winter also has some stuff, but it's bloggy and declared by China as "a hostile overseas media operation" ... So your milage may vary?
Is this an actually good faith inquiry? Are you that deep in the kool aid?
I’m just a bit incredulous that you actually think this argument would be convincing to anyone.
You don’t see any reason why dictators of Muslim countries might want to say nice things about China despite obvious abuses against the Uighurs?
I’ve got to log off but if no one has answered you more seriously later I’ll give it a go.
Yeah I mean obviously lol I never said they’re not influenced by the US. The point is statements and policies by corrupt autocrats have no bearing the real situation on the ground. That’s not evidence, it’s politics. They will just say whatever is in their best interest regardless of the truth.
Your point about the US influence regarding Palestine is hilariously misinformed because they literally do that. That’s why none of these countries have done anything about Palestine. The only ones who have taken concrete actions are those that are basically already engaged in proxy wars with the west, such as Iran or the Houthis. Others like the Saudis, the new Syrian government and Egypt just want this issue to go away. That’s why Egypt is in the process of blocking the Gaza caravan as we speak. These autocrats don’t even care about their own people, let alone foreigners thousands of miles away.
Also, there are reasons the geopolitics favor the Chinese point of view on the Uighur issue. The CPC is obviously going to care a lot more about this issue than the US does because it’s a domestic security issue. For the US it’s just a way to tarnish China’s image, which of course they want to do, but it’s not a top priority. Furthermore, the ruling class is biased towards stability. They just want to keep exploiting people and living opulent lives in peace. They’re much more likely to try to ignore or diminish these problems than actually try to solve them because that risks pissing people off which could be dangerous for them. Finally, these countries also love to oppress their own people, so they’d just as soon everyone stop talking about human rights since that would obviously be to their benefit. Talking about prison camps in another country makes them more vulnerable to looking hypocritical when they engage in domestic repression.
And finally, there’s just abundant and overwhelming evidence of human rights abuses that don’t come from the US government, which yea, is obviously dishonest. The camps can be seen in satellite imagery, and the CPC acknowledges they exist but bizarrely claim that it’s good to force huge numbers of people into concentration camps. That’s such an unserious response that I don’t feel it’s necessary to respond to.
I don’t need a citation to demonstrate that statements from politicians are not evidence of anything. That’s not even relevant to the claim that the UN has rejected the claims regarding atrocities inflicted on the Uighurs, which you also never substantiated. By the way, here’s an actual UN report alleging serious human rights abuses: https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/08/1125932
This is an anarchist community. My disdain for politicians is not specific to the US’s adversaries. They always pursue their own interests. To understand their behavior, you need to understand their incentives, which I explained above.
But if there’s a specific claim you want a source for, let me know. None of it is particularly controversial.
this is true and you should say it. I'm sorry about the people who will be assholes about it.
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