Fairphone has sources available for it and an unlockable bootloader. There are nightly builds of Lineage already available for the FP6
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Fairphone with graphene os and headphone jack would be awesome.
I want a phone completely untouched by Google. No Google hardware, no upstream Google dependencies at all. Hardware that I control and a more “traditional” flavor of Linux with a mobile-native DE.
Maybe you will find this interesting: https://furilabs.com/shop/flx1/
I would love to have an immutable easy to upgrade system similar to unblue aurora or bluefin, but based on Postmarket os, but with extra security like SE Linux a proper firewalls flatpak support hardend_memory alloc etc. And also Good container support.
Aswell as a way droid version with a few features of graphene os like per App network toggle aswell as storage and contact scopes Sandboxed Google play etc.
And then with a mix between the Sony Xperia 1 VII and a fairphone 6. Such a phone would be awesome.
On a different note the progress the post market is team is making is really promising who knows maybe Linux on a phone will be daily drivable in a few years.
Also I like your drawings and art style/visualization.
It also needs to be upgradeable between generations like the framework laptops are. If it had that and a headphone jack I would buy one, but without those absolutely not. I'm not willing to pay anywhere near their prices for something I'm still going to have to replace in a few years, and after learning my lesson with my current OnePlus 9 I am absolutely never buying another phone without a headphone jack
I wonder how difficult it would be to make a phone that's easily upgradable like a desktop. And to install os as easily.
Upgradability should be easy, just keep the connectors and positions the same between generations and there you go.
And for easy OS replacement, just make the SD slot bootable like on the pinephone and then you can boot and install things from there.
Easier said than done. Phones are tiny, so you can't really fit everything in a modular grid system since things need to overlap, stack, etc... And you can't just make everything the same size every year because things just physically take up different amounts of room as they change and there isn't any room to spare for future upgradability. Batteries grow/shrink, cameras get turned into sideways periscopic lenses, fingerprint sensors grow and get placed under screens, etc. You can't just tack on an sd card reader or ir blaster if there's no space for it. Not to mention cpus change and you can't just run everything over pcie and ribbon cables.
Realistically, what would even be upgradable in a phone that wouldn't require resizing or repositioning internal components?
Battery? We can already do that but manufacturers refuse to in favor of sub-par water resistance and planed obscelesce. Plus, battery tech doesn't advance quickly enough that you'd get a meaningful capacity boost in the same footprint.
Cpu or ram? Upgrades really won't make a meaningful difference until your entire phone is old enough that it makes more sense to buy a new one.
Camera? Maybe slightly more useful than upgrading cpu/ram, but cameras are expensive and heavily depend on economies of scale to be as good as they are without costing a fortune.
Also, it's really easy to break your phone when you open it up, so there'd need to be additional barriers and hardened connectors to make it user friendly, which again takes up precious space.
Just make the phone a brick, you say? That might work...
OS replacement, however, is easy. Just unlock the bootloader, no sd slot needed. Any phone could do it.
There have been companies that tried. It just never went anywhere. Project Ara was probably the most iconic attempt. I wanted it to come out sooooo bad.
This is going to get buried, but I’m so glad to see this discussion on our comm!! This is something I’ve tried to bring up among other communities I’m in and it never really gains traction. Almost 100 comments on this is awesome!! Luv y’all very much!
heyhi ~ ~ ~ <3
im also happy this kinda post ig getting traction... i guess i should stick with this much simpler type of post... normally i make them like - suuuuuper colorful which kinda makes them less approachblable.... meanwhile this one here looks almost... like advertising...
Maybe supporting more US-based carriers would hook me.
However, I applaud their efforts in addressing modern slavery and child slavery in their supply chains and manufacturing.
It is rampant, and buying many forms of technology are supporting those supply chains.
This post really resonates with me and I've already said my piece about jack removal and BT buds arriving at the same time by FP.
The realization I came to is that FP is not an enthusiast brand and doesn't want to be; it is not the Framework of phones.
They cater to the broadest market segment, they want to be the repairable Samsung, rather. And it shows.
Is there any brand that does want to be the Framework of phones?
Xiaomi and OnePlus used to be. Repairability, cheap(er), good specs, reliable. Now Xiaomis are stupidly unreliable and practically not bl-unlockable and OnePlus is starting to block bl unlocking in some regions, they don't allow avb-yellow and are expensive as shit. Nowy maybe nothing if we ignore the light bullshit.
They were able to capture various national markets by competing on being favorable to consumer wants, now that they have a strong foothold, or straight up control whole markets, they get to juice their profits.
Used to have a OnePlus Nord. Broke the screen 3 years after the phone released and there were no replacement parts anywhere, besides a single AliExpress seller. It didn't make things better that they released multiple versions of the same model, most, if not all, had incompatible screens.
The screen protectors for both Nord and 8T were out of stock less than a year after the phones were released, never to be seen again.
I've recently come across this: https://www.shift.eco/en/shiftphone-8/. Unfortunately also no headphone jack... But when my current phone breaks this might be the phone to get, for me at least.
Damn, the is so sick... except for the missing jack. What a bummer :(
Interesting. Any idea how compatible it would be with US mobile networks? I'm currently using Mint/T-Mobile (not Verizon, which is notoriously incompatible) but every time I've found an EU phone that looks appealing in the past compatibility was always a possible concern so I never got any.
I don't speak German and after some searching I am still not sure. Most of the results are full of speculative/preview type info and focused on performance.
TLDR - focus on features people want.
You think people don't want accessories..?
I'd trade their dumb accessories for a qi2 magnet. Stop trying to make a new ecosystem when a universal ecosystem exists around qi2
ooooooh!!! i thought that was some apple proprietary bs stuff - but apparently not - cool! <3
Actually, the magnet stuff (not the actual wireless charging) is an Apple thing, but—as far as I know—it is still free to be used.
I think it originated with Apple, but it was accepted as the standard.
I like this new look on Apple, they contributed partly to USBc and partially to qi2
I would add proper Linux mainline support here.
That would allow other non-android options as well, and makes it be supported for the near future. And will likely have a network effect, allowing other phones with similar hardware to be supported as well.
I like the idea of the fairphobe, but its too big and too expensive. I'm poor and have small pockets. There are no contemporary phones that work for me.
I like the idea of the fairphobe
The fairphobe scares me.
Just got a pixel 9 for graphene since it seems that the 10 will only have eSIM support, which sucks.
Oh my god, Nokia. They don't have unlockable bootloader and bullshit about longevity. Great. And I liked the old symbian Nokias, but this is just stupid.
I feel like most of these are at least misleading if not outright false (or maybe I'm misunderstanding them, so please correct me if I do).
- Allow custom ROMs: It does, and there is even a Google-free variant they sell on their store.
- Dual SIM and SD card slot: There may not be dual slots, but there is Dual SIM (one physical, one eSIM), and I'm not sure I've ever seen a phone with multiple SD card slots.
- Programmable "moments" button: The button is not programmable per se, but there are different settings to make it do different things.
- No dumb accessories: If you don't find them useful, don't buy them?
- Headphone jack: Fair enough, I do miss that one, but the USB-C with an adapter works okay, and I'm still using the same headphones that I've used for years.
Headphone jack: Fair enough, I do miss that one, but the USB-C with an adapter works okay, and I'm still using the same headphones that I've used for years.
I do this as well, but I would also like to charge the phone while I have my headphones connected to it, and all these additional adapter chains often don't work very reliable, and are much more cumbersome to deal with.
Dual SIM and SD card slot: There may not be dual slots, but there is Dual SIM (one physical, one eSIM), and I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a phone with multiple SD card slots.
Still, I prefer 2 physical slots. Some phones also have Dual SIM + eSIM, where 2 of them can be active at a time.
My current phone has Dual SIM + SD. I have all three populated, on of them with 9esim adapter. Removable eSIM. Easy to replace, and stores multiple profiles.
As for the second thing: https://www.androidheadlines.com/2016/01/hands-on-with-the-saygus-v2-smartphone.html
dual sim slot phones were very common in some markets where you needed to have multiple carriers. It's a lot less common now that eSIM exists, but before then it was a common thing for the EU version of a phone to have dual sim slots when the NA versions were only single sim.
I currently have four eSIMs on my phone. I would love nothing more than to get rid of the last remaining physical SIM.
Ideally, also get rid of the whole slot to improve water resistance.
I would MUCH rather they focus on optimisation and power efficiency. My work iPhone can easily last two days on a single charge, three if I'm not really using it that much, all the while giving me all the processing power I'd need to run high-quality games on it. No Android phones comes anywhere near this and it grinds my gears.
All I'm saying is: different people, different needs.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC. If the phone breaks, I can immediately put it into another phone and use it. Mine even has STK menu for switching and renaming profiles, so it also works in most dumb phones.
Plus all that is free. In my country, eSIM profile download codes are single use, and you pay for them. Swan is €8, O2 €10, Orange €10, only Telekom does it for free.
But yeah, in my case, that could easily mean having to pay upwards of €60 just to put the fucking SIM cards into another phone.
Oh, fun fact, I wanted to try one plan at Orange, but screw it. The physical SIM is free, including shipping to home, but for eSIM they wanted €10.25 (while the plan would be €20/mo), and I don't have empty slots for them.
Meh, average carrier shenanigans. Ereyesterday I wrote to my carrier about being unable to make phone calls, they replied me to call them to "continue the case" after unsuccessfully (who could have guessed) trying to call me. Bro...
At least somebody probably understood what just happened, so they emailed me.
Well, guess your last sentence works.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC.
Are you able to have two of them enabled at the same time, or is there a limit to one, since it treats it like a SIM card?
Plus all that is free. In my country, eSIM profile download codes are single use, and you pay for them. Swan is €8, O2 €10 (...) The physical SIM is free, including shipping to home, but for eSIM they wanted €10.25
Wow, that's insane!
I wrote to my carrier about being unable to make phone calls, they replied me to call them to “continue the case” after unsuccessfully (who could have guessed) trying to call me. Bro…
Was that LycaMobile?
At least somebody probably understood what just happened, so they emailed me.
Ah, never mind, not Lyca after all. These fuckers close FOUR CASES that I raised after failing to contact me, when I was reporting not being able to take calls.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC.
Are you able to have two of them enabled at the same time, or is there a limit to one, since it treats it like a SIM card?
Yeah, just one at a time.
But maybe it could work on some devices, though I am not sure if with this adapter, since it has that extra STK menu, so it may work differently.
Really, the same eUICC chip that would normally be soldered into a phone can be soldered onto SC contact pads and used like that too: https://xdaforums.com/t/a-tricky-way-to-use-esim-on-cn-in-variant.4609543/
Difference is, this will require root to be used on most devices, since the chip doesn't explicitly allow the respective apps to manage it.
However, there's some mentions that some devices may actually just recognize it as an eSIM even in settings, which is also mentioned here: https://osmocom.org/projects/pysim/wiki/UE_behavior_with_plastic_eUICC
Rumour is that some UEs will treat such an external eUICC just like an internal one, i.e. their normal LPAd would be able to manage and/or download eSIM profiles to it.
However, there may also be some issues with this. I've seen quite a few reports of these cards bricking Samsung devices, requiring a factory reset. And the linked article also mentions persisting issues after using the internal SIM manager on Pixel 4a 5G.
What happens on Samsungs is that they suddenly won't show an IMEI and they won't recognize any SIM card.
ur right bout the first two... i updated the posts content becuz of it (som hours ago)
but the accessories - see - i like the idea, bzt sadly they opted for a screw-on desgin... which then made the phone have two black screws on the back, in places where ur fingers would be.... whivh spawns a big uncomfy feeling in me - so its mostly a personal thing-
but yes, ur points r very valid n i agree.
I straight up refuse to ever buy bt headphones. I never really had a desire to use them, and having them as the only option pisses off some deep part of my soul that hates the power being exerted for such a selfish reason.
I just don't listen to audio on my phone without playing it through a wireless speaker, or playing it through the built in speaker(in private of course). I honestly don't miss it, instead finding other ways to pass the time around other people.
hates the power being exerted for such a selfish reason.
I just don't listen to audio on my phone without playing it through a wireless speaker, or playing it through the built in speaker.
You do realize that playing music on anything but a tiny speaker requires more power than BT+headphones? Even playing it loud in the built-in speakers can be note wasteful than later versions of Bluetooth.
Bluetooth transmission power costs are insignificant. But you don't need to justify preferring the option to have regular wired earbuds on a phone.
As a firm believer in wired headphones: you can buy an adapter to plug your 3.5mm in the USB-C. IMO it's not ideal, but they're small pieces and you can keep them connected to your headphones at all times, so you don't even have to think about bringing them with you.
Personally, I made a 3.5mm jack non-negotiable for my phone, which severely limited my options. Next time I'll probably have to get an adapter... :(
I’ve been forced to resort to them since it seems pin on my power port that handles audio signal has failed.
I hate playing stuff I’m listening to on speakers, even in private, I just always feel like someone else might be around, and I don’t want to annoy them, or even worse, have them judge me. It just makes me uncomfortable.
Cellphones in the US don't have headphone jacks anymore? I thought that was just an Apple thing. My Redmi has almost everything in that drawing except its not customizable.
Almost all the smartphones around the world don't have a headphone jack, there are some exceptions to this rule but in general that's the "trend"
Almost all the smartphones being sold around the world*
If we consider the smartphones in use, I'm not sure this would be the case
Oh, I see. Seems like a recent change, both my mom and my sis' phones all have jacks, but none of us ever cared on staying on top of things when it comes to electronics releases. I've done a brief search, and seems a few new models of Xiaomi still come with them, but I don't believe those are sold in the US.
Does everyone clamoring for a return to the 3.5mm headphone jack not realize USB-C headphones exist?
That would only be a real solution if manufacturers included two USB-C ports, and at that point just include a headphone jack so people aren't limited in which headphones they can use if they don't want to have to keep track of stupid little adapters that get lost.
It's nice to be able to listen to music and charge your phone at the same time, without the need for a splitter cable.
Works, but isn't the same. Needs one more stuff to buy and carry around, and can't be used while charging and connected to a device via usb
Some of us are very happy with our current headphones and don't want new ones. Plus as others said the charging thing.
not realize USB-C headphones exist?
I realize those exist enough to also realize I do not want the USB-C connector to get damage due to torsion and stress when having connected a thing for which a connector which naturally allows rotation is far more senseful.
If USB-C had been made round (so as to avoid the Schrödinger plugging issue common to all USB standards so far) this wouldn't be a problem.
if you're talking about headphones that are only USB-C, that's a no-go. i plug my headphones into more than one device any given day. Switch can do USB-C audio, but anything retro can't and i spend a lot of time at the arcade.
if you're talking about adapters, before switching away from Apple i did use the official lightning-3.5mm adapter: it worked, but even those official adapters would become flaky after 6-7 weeks of daily use. couldn't walk and listen to music at the same time because the phone acted as if the headphones were being connected and disconnected every time i took a step. went through 3 of them before giving up and switching back to a phone with 3.5mm.
so, idk. 3.5mm just works. USB-C doesn't just work. music + messaging + reading are the primary things i use my phone for. an "upgrade" isn't an upgrade if it's worse at one of those things without being better at any of them.
i totally agree thad usb c is the future connector for most things, but currently every device besides phones offers a headphone jack... because most headphones bein produced rn use headphone jacks-.... yea-
so, if u use any device which is not a smartphone but wana use the headphones on it, those headphones better not be usb c...
I already have headphones I love with a 3.5mm jack. I hate having to use a fragile adapter to use them.
Sony's flagships still have one and apperantly a pretty good one. Although their newest phone costs 1500€ which is like nope not for me. It also supports SD card slot
Finally gets a decent proc to match it's midrange price
Still only 256GB option
Downgrades to USB 2.0
Maybe by FP 10 they'll finally get it right
I've thought about this sort of thing a bit with fairphone and framework, and decided that I don't really care about easy repairability for me. Sustainability and replacement parts still definitely matter, but I'm willing to put up with a harder repair if it saves me a few hundred dollars up front.
The only real reason I would get a fairphone or framework product would be to support the company and their ideals. Which is very valuable and could maybe even put pressure on the industry, I'm just not sure I'm willing to spend the extra few hundred dollars for that.
Then I have a Samsung phone to sell you. Where the OS updates frequently to cut your battery's lifespan in half, and a screen that looks beautiful but costs 300 dollars to replace, unless you want an aftermarket part with half the refresh rate and pixel quality off ebay.
You're not getting a repairable device for just yourself to repair. You'll also be making your life easier when you go to a repair shop and a technician like me has to look at the hoops to jump through to get it resolved (passing the costs onto you ofc).
Unless you have money to burn. Then buy a subscription repair service like AppleCare or Samsung+. At least those guys work on salary.
Honestly, I still like what they do have. Not having to deal with a service center and being able to easily replace my own battery or charging port when something goes tits up.
But it does really sting that there just isn’t any phone that comes close to approaching what I want.
Honestly I don’t even really care about having a flagship level SOC. I don’t need a processor that can run more sophisticated programs. So long as it loads web pages and plays media, at most runs a doc like program, I’m quite happy.
But given that my main use case is media, I’d really like to have something where I can listen to stuff, not using speakers, not having to worry about the charge on a Bluetooth device, and be able to have my phone charging at the same time. Like, there are those splitter dongles but I’ve found them to be just such a head ache to use, inconsistent in their function, and so easy to lose or break.
Also the fact that FP are kind of hard to get where I live is annoying, but, that’s hardly the fault of FP.
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