▲ 487 ▼ Simon Pegg on the Cornell Rapists (sh.itjust.works) submitted 1 month ago by velma@sh.itjust.works to c/fauxmoi@sh.itjust.works locked 278 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -7 points 1 month ago (8 children) What's a lot? permalink fedilink source hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] velma@sh.itjust.works [S] 29 points 1 month ago (7 children) At least 57 men in that group chat that saw those texts and never said a word to protect that woman. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 month ago (1 child) Frat culture is rape culture permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago So get rid of fraternities. That would be more effective than some platitude about what we need to teach our sons as if most of us didn't already know rape is bad. Like those stupid annual sexual harassment workshops I had to do at my old job. You know what those taught me? Not a damn thing I didn't already know, and anyone who didn't would be too stupid to function. It's almost like bad people will do bad things, regardless of what they know. permalink fedilink source parent [–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -3 points 1 month ago (4 children) What I meant is what percentage of a population are degenerate scumbags and what educational metrics are we going to badger the entire male population with as if we're all mentally retarded? At what percentage will we pass a desired threshold we deem acceptable? Look, I'm a male. No one explicitly gave me a lesson on not raping people that taught me something like a revelation. Yet I would never, and if I were aware of such things going on I'd intervene. No man in my life would do such a thing. I've seen figures as low as .012% to as high as 30%. Nobody knows anything for sure and data on this is all over the place, flawed, and difficult to acquire. Was this case a horror? Yep. Does that mean I agree there's a large enough population of degenerate men that warrants a systemic change in male education? No. Get rid of fraternities and sororities? Sure. Get alcohol and drugs out of campuses? Sure. Start treating all men as a whole like we're too dumb to know rape is immoral? I don't think that's going to have any impact whatsoever. You think those 57 men were a lecture away from meaningful change? 27,000 attend Cornell University. 57 men is 0.2% of the entire population there. The original post is "Durrrr of course it's not ALL men. But it's A LOT." So if THAT'S a lot, that's a borderline meaningless statement. I just like specificity. No bs vague crap like "a lot" because people are too dumb and too emotional to bring data to the table. Who exactly are we going to teach what and to what desired goal? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 month ago (3 children) Start treating all men as a whole like we’re too dumb to know rape is immoral? Consent and bodily autonomy do need to be taught. This isn't some knowledge that you're born with. Sure, a guy might know that "rape is wrong", but they might not understand that somebody could be too intoxicated to consent for example. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 month ago Off topic, how does consent and intoxication work if both parties are under the influence, anyway? Looks at comment section Yeah... For the sake of avoiding unnecessary toxicity in this hypothetical, let's go with two people of the same gender. Men, women, whatever. They get heavily drunk, end up sleeping together. Next morning, mayhem ensues. What happens? Are both parties guilty? Neither? Does it matter who initiated? Levels of intoxication? Degree of shame and regret? permalink fedilink source parent [+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -8 points 1 month ago (1 child) That's what you think the problem was? That that entire group chat of Ivy Leaguers was simply uneducated on consent? I think that's... Adorable. And naive. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] velma@sh.itjust.works [S] 29 points 1 month ago (7 children) At least 57 men in that group chat that saw those texts and never said a word to protect that woman. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 month ago (1 child) Frat culture is rape culture permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago So get rid of fraternities. That would be more effective than some platitude about what we need to teach our sons as if most of us didn't already know rape is bad. Like those stupid annual sexual harassment workshops I had to do at my old job. You know what those taught me? Not a damn thing I didn't already know, and anyone who didn't would be too stupid to function. It's almost like bad people will do bad things, regardless of what they know. permalink fedilink source parent [–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -3 points 1 month ago (4 children) What I meant is what percentage of a population are degenerate scumbags and what educational metrics are we going to badger the entire male population with as if we're all mentally retarded? At what percentage will we pass a desired threshold we deem acceptable? Look, I'm a male. No one explicitly gave me a lesson on not raping people that taught me something like a revelation. Yet I would never, and if I were aware of such things going on I'd intervene. No man in my life would do such a thing. I've seen figures as low as .012% to as high as 30%. Nobody knows anything for sure and data on this is all over the place, flawed, and difficult to acquire. Was this case a horror? Yep. Does that mean I agree there's a large enough population of degenerate men that warrants a systemic change in male education? No. Get rid of fraternities and sororities? Sure. Get alcohol and drugs out of campuses? Sure. Start treating all men as a whole like we're too dumb to know rape is immoral? I don't think that's going to have any impact whatsoever. You think those 57 men were a lecture away from meaningful change? 27,000 attend Cornell University. 57 men is 0.2% of the entire population there. The original post is "Durrrr of course it's not ALL men. But it's A LOT." So if THAT'S a lot, that's a borderline meaningless statement. I just like specificity. No bs vague crap like "a lot" because people are too dumb and too emotional to bring data to the table. Who exactly are we going to teach what and to what desired goal? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 month ago (3 children) Start treating all men as a whole like we’re too dumb to know rape is immoral? Consent and bodily autonomy do need to be taught. This isn't some knowledge that you're born with. Sure, a guy might know that "rape is wrong", but they might not understand that somebody could be too intoxicated to consent for example. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 month ago Off topic, how does consent and intoxication work if both parties are under the influence, anyway? Looks at comment section Yeah... For the sake of avoiding unnecessary toxicity in this hypothetical, let's go with two people of the same gender. Men, women, whatever. They get heavily drunk, end up sleeping together. Next morning, mayhem ensues. What happens? Are both parties guilty? Neither? Does it matter who initiated? Levels of intoxication? Degree of shame and regret? permalink fedilink source parent [+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -8 points 1 month ago (1 child) That's what you think the problem was? That that entire group chat of Ivy Leaguers was simply uneducated on consent? I think that's... Adorable. And naive. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 month ago (1 child) Frat culture is rape culture permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago So get rid of fraternities. That would be more effective than some platitude about what we need to teach our sons as if most of us didn't already know rape is bad. Like those stupid annual sexual harassment workshops I had to do at my old job. You know what those taught me? Not a damn thing I didn't already know, and anyone who didn't would be too stupid to function. It's almost like bad people will do bad things, regardless of what they know. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago So get rid of fraternities. That would be more effective than some platitude about what we need to teach our sons as if most of us didn't already know rape is bad. Like those stupid annual sexual harassment workshops I had to do at my old job. You know what those taught me? Not a damn thing I didn't already know, and anyone who didn't would be too stupid to function. It's almost like bad people will do bad things, regardless of what they know. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -3 points 1 month ago (4 children) What I meant is what percentage of a population are degenerate scumbags and what educational metrics are we going to badger the entire male population with as if we're all mentally retarded? At what percentage will we pass a desired threshold we deem acceptable? Look, I'm a male. No one explicitly gave me a lesson on not raping people that taught me something like a revelation. Yet I would never, and if I were aware of such things going on I'd intervene. No man in my life would do such a thing. I've seen figures as low as .012% to as high as 30%. Nobody knows anything for sure and data on this is all over the place, flawed, and difficult to acquire. Was this case a horror? Yep. Does that mean I agree there's a large enough population of degenerate men that warrants a systemic change in male education? No. Get rid of fraternities and sororities? Sure. Get alcohol and drugs out of campuses? Sure. Start treating all men as a whole like we're too dumb to know rape is immoral? I don't think that's going to have any impact whatsoever. You think those 57 men were a lecture away from meaningful change? 27,000 attend Cornell University. 57 men is 0.2% of the entire population there. The original post is "Durrrr of course it's not ALL men. But it's A LOT." So if THAT'S a lot, that's a borderline meaningless statement. I just like specificity. No bs vague crap like "a lot" because people are too dumb and too emotional to bring data to the table. Who exactly are we going to teach what and to what desired goal? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 month ago (3 children) Start treating all men as a whole like we’re too dumb to know rape is immoral? Consent and bodily autonomy do need to be taught. This isn't some knowledge that you're born with. Sure, a guy might know that "rape is wrong", but they might not understand that somebody could be too intoxicated to consent for example. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 month ago Off topic, how does consent and intoxication work if both parties are under the influence, anyway? Looks at comment section Yeah... For the sake of avoiding unnecessary toxicity in this hypothetical, let's go with two people of the same gender. Men, women, whatever. They get heavily drunk, end up sleeping together. Next morning, mayhem ensues. What happens? Are both parties guilty? Neither? Does it matter who initiated? Levels of intoxication? Degree of shame and regret? permalink fedilink source parent [+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -8 points 1 month ago (1 child) That's what you think the problem was? That that entire group chat of Ivy Leaguers was simply uneducated on consent? I think that's... Adorable. And naive. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 month ago (3 children) Start treating all men as a whole like we’re too dumb to know rape is immoral? Consent and bodily autonomy do need to be taught. This isn't some knowledge that you're born with. Sure, a guy might know that "rape is wrong", but they might not understand that somebody could be too intoxicated to consent for example. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 month ago Off topic, how does consent and intoxication work if both parties are under the influence, anyway? Looks at comment section Yeah... For the sake of avoiding unnecessary toxicity in this hypothetical, let's go with two people of the same gender. Men, women, whatever. They get heavily drunk, end up sleeping together. Next morning, mayhem ensues. What happens? Are both parties guilty? Neither? Does it matter who initiated? Levels of intoxication? Degree of shame and regret? permalink fedilink source parent [+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -8 points 1 month ago (1 child) That's what you think the problem was? That that entire group chat of Ivy Leaguers was simply uneducated on consent? I think that's... Adorable. And naive. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] AwesomeLowlander@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 month ago Off topic, how does consent and intoxication work if both parties are under the influence, anyway? Looks at comment section Yeah... For the sake of avoiding unnecessary toxicity in this hypothetical, let's go with two people of the same gender. Men, women, whatever. They get heavily drunk, end up sleeping together. Next morning, mayhem ensues. What happens? Are both parties guilty? Neither? Does it matter who initiated? Levels of intoxication? Degree of shame and regret? permalink fedilink source parent
[+] GaMEChld@lemmy.world -8 points 1 month ago (1 child) That's what you think the problem was? That that entire group chat of Ivy Leaguers was simply uneducated on consent? I think that's... Adorable. And naive. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 month ago I think that they were brought up to believe that either this kind of behavior is okay or, at least, that they wouldn't be punished for it. Or if they were punished, it wouldn't be severe. I believe that there are plenty of men out there who think that if she consents, then it can't be rape, even if she isn't in a state of mind where she can consent. I don't find that hard to believe at all. What do you think the reason is? Are some people just born rapists? permalink fedilink source parent
