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[–] 14 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (12 children)

Authorities said the bicyclist was heading eastbound on Ironwood Hill Drive when he was struck by a blue 2024 Ford Escape that was trying to turn left from westbound Ironwood Hill Drive onto southbound Greasewood Road.

A DUI Unit officer determined the driver was not impaired, but authorities said the driver was charged with misdemeanor Causing Serious Physical Injury/Death by a Moving Violation.

Given that's the driver's only violation of traffic law here, a misdemeanor seems appropriate. The bulk of the blame here lies with the city and its urban design.


Edit: Here's some context for what I mean:

Aerial screenshot of the intersection

This is the intersection in question. I've drawn the bicyclist's path in blue and the truck's path in purple. The speed limit here is 35 mph, or approximately 55 kph. Look at it on something like Street View if you like.

There is no bicycle infrastructure around here. The gutters that are here are completely unprotected and aren't even marked for bikes. Not only that, but it's crossing a riverbed, making it one of the few places a bicyclist coming from or going to a fairly large suburban area can access the rest of the city (the other way, another mile south, is "Speedway Boulevard", which as you can guess is even less safe).

There should be no world in which bicycles are sharing this infrastructure with cars, and it's the city's fault they have to.

I don't think it's right to put the entire weight of that enormous societal failure on someone who wasn't fully paying attention when they were turning left.

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  • [–] 25 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    We can do both. The city should be fined and forced to improve infrastructure. The driver should be held to task for failing to properly operate a multi-ton vehicle. Their job as a licensed driver is to be the safest, most responsible person possible and make corrections for any hazards or circumstances that may arise. There is NO excuse to kill someone just because you wanted to turn left and these punishments aren't nearly enough.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

    There is NO excuse to kill someone just because you wanted to turn left and these punishments aren’t nearly enough.

    That's not what was happening here, or at least there's nothing to suggest that's what was happening here.

    This happened at 06:00. Sunrise in Tucson yesterday was approximately 06:15, so it was dark. Westbound traffic has a traffic light and is allowed to turn left. What ostensibly happened is that this driver had a green light (but not a green arrow), didn't see anybody coming, and turned into a bicyclist, killing them. A driver is being held to task for failing to properly operate a multi-ton vehicle – they're being held to task for their portion of the fault.

    Screenshot of the intersection westbound from Google Street View

    We can do both.

    You can do both, but you have to do both proportionally instead of throwing up your hands and saying "well they both suck". Clearly, the bulk of the blame rests with the city, because a) cars and bicycles should not have to share this space, and b) any reasonable planner would foresee this kind of problem. This is horribly designed in a way that charging anything more than a misdemeanor would be unjust and a ridiculous stretch of consequentialism.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago

    There are no accidents, only collisions.

    As long as society at large sees that the consequences for killing someone with a car can be a slap on the wrist, it is injustice.

    Justice is a difficult topic. It would be one thing if this was the first car crashing into a bicycle ever, and the mayor, governor, and president all decried the tragedy and closed the roads until improvements could be made. Then i could see giving the driver a misdemeanor since society is taking responsibility and justice is being done.

    Is this another day in the life in America? Maybe with more serious consequences for the driver, there would be political will to actually change things and prevent these tragedies.

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  • If you're driving somewhere horribly designed or something, then you have to drive more slowly and carefully. It's absolutely no excuse to crash your vehicle into any object. Doesn't matter if it's bad road design or bad weather, you are responsible for driving your car.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago

    That's a pretty normal (bad) intersection. I would agree society in general holds much of the blame but I also don't think a misdemeanor is appropriate for someone who killed another person while not paying attention.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago (4 children)
  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago* (3 children)

    Bike had right of way.

    Yes. Literally everyone here understood that. Did you want to add something to this discussion?

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago* (2 children)

    Is your entire argument that we shouldn't charge traffic violations which result in deaths as felonys because we currently don't? Exceedingly few people in this thread care about this case they want to fix the law to properly provide disincentives which is what criminal liability is for.

    You better fucking not be taking turns before verifying that it's safe to do so.

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