you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[+] -14 points 2 months ago (28 children)

Missing a lot of context and no idea whose drink was at the beginning (was he grabbing her drink? was she trying to grab his?), but I'd say he was wrong for kicking her (not self defense) and wrong for using potentially deadly force when he pushed her violently to the ground at the end (not an appropriate response to her threatening him with the beer bottle). Pushing somebody like that in self defense and then retreating, is fine in an open field. In a cluttered area like this, high risk of concussion (which looks to have happened here).

  • source
  • hideshow 28 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 2 months ago (15 children)

    Watching throughout the video, there are two glasses on the table, and he grabs the one closer to him. Hers appears to be empty at this time.

    not an appropriate response to her threatening him with the beer bottle

    In a physical altercation, a beer bottle is considered a deadly weapon. We've seen too many Hollywood-style, sugar-glass bottles being broken over people's heads to really think of them that way, but the reality is that the shattering of a glass bottle in a fight can easily cause severe lacerations to the face, eyes, neck, etc. He had already shown that he was retreating from the altercation when she picked up the bottle and confronted him. That final shove was the most defensible act of the entire altercation.

    The kick will be the hardest act for his lawyer to explain.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 15 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 2 months ago (14 children)

    The kick will be the hardest act for his lawyer to explain.

    The kick is assault.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 14 child comments
  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (13 children)

    The kick is assault.

    Battery, but that's a fairly minor distinction. I will admit that the kick really pissed me off.

    But, the kick came as she was getting back up from being justifiably shoved away after having lunged over the table and striking him unjustifiably. He could argue he believed she was getting up to continue striking him, and that the kick was only to keep her from further attacking him while he retreated. If he shuts up and lets his lawyer explain that, it probably won't be considered unjustifiable. It would probably be considered reasonable doubt. The kick will be hardest to explain, but it is certainly possible.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 13 child comments
  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago (12 children)

    The kick did not piss you off. You spent the last two hours doing laps in this comment section blaming her.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 12 child comments
  • [–] -2 points 2 months ago (11 children)

    The kick did not piss you off.

    It certainly did. That's what "questionable" means here. It means that before applying the legal precedent of "innocence until proven guilty" and "benefit of a reasonable doubt", my immediate, snap judgment was to be pissed off at the kick. Only after closely considering the circumstances of the kick did I arrive at the conclusion of "questionable". I, personally, don't think the kick was necessary at that moment. But, in this context, I can't definitively conclude that. I provided a hypothetical mindset where his actions would be reasonable. If those circumstances were present in his trial, I would have to afford him reasonable doubt and acquit.

    On the other hand, if she's the one on trial, I would have to afford her reasonable doubt, and conclude that the kick was unjustified. I don't think that kick would significantly affect the outcome of her trial, but I would consider it in her favor regardless.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 11 child comments
  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Lmfao trying to change the definition of a word so you can backtrack, nah man. Fuck off. You were practically spitting on this woman's actions with your words in this thread and acted like her touching a bottle twice was ASSAULT!!! You wrote page after page of text to justify his actions.

    You're disgusting and now you're pathetic too. Shut the fuck up.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago* (1 child)

    I am, indeed, "spitting on this woman's actions", regardless of my anger toward him. I found one minor and one potential fault in his actions. I found several serious faults in hers. I have carefully, and dispassionately evaluated the scenario, and I have found considerable fault on her part.

    I am continuing to discuss it only to ensure that I have thoroughly explored all reasonable possibilities.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (7 children)

    For context:

    This is what you said.

    She grabbed his drink. Assault.

    She tried to stand back up; he kicked her back to the ground. Questionable

    You're a fucking moron.

    Questionable here means you're mad? You fucking absolutely disgusting shit. Shut the absolute fuck up

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (6 children)

    Here, questionable does, indeed, mean that I'm pissed off about the kick. As I said, my initial knee-jerk reaction was to condemn him for the kick. "Questionable" arises from one hypothetical possibility that would make my anger inappropriate. Legal doctrine requires the assumption of that hypothetical possibility until conclusively proven otherwise.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    No it doesn't stop trying to change definitions. You played defense for this man's actions and straight accused her of assault.

    Legal doctrine requires the assumption of that hypothetical possibility until conclusively proven otherwise.

    You keep trying to sound like you know the law and you don't. You've proven that with your misunderstanding of what intent means. Shut up

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    and straight accused her of assault.

    I continue to straight up accuse her of assault. Two counts of simple assault, two counts of battery, one count of assault with a deadly weapon.

    I continue to defend his initial push, as well as the final shove. I do not defend the throwing of the liquid in her face: It was provoked, but it was unjustified. I provided a reasonable doubt as to the kick; his kick is only defensible if that doubt exists.

    You keep trying to sound like you know the law and you don’t.

    The law requires the accused be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. I have incorporated that standard into my analysis.

    You’ve proven that with your misunderstanding of what intent means.

    Intent is not particularly relevant here. Only justification is relevant. The only unjustified acts of his were the throwing of the liquid (which was a provoked act and likely excusable) and possibly the kick (which could potentially be considered justifiable as I have previously described.)

    Her unjustified acts include the initial grabbing of the glass, the initial striking with the hands, and the continued menacing with the beer bottle.

    Is there some part of this that I have not properly or adequately considered?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (3 children)

    intent is not particularly relevant here. Only justification is relevant

    Holy shit you're stupid you genuinely do not understand what intent means in a legal sense.

    Intent is justification you moron. You didn't Google it once.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    I have read this article on general intent and this article on specific intent. I have also read this article on justification as well as this article on self defense which also discusses justification.

    Intent and justification are two separate concepts. "Intent" refers to the actor's internal state of mind. "Justification" refers to the external conditions the actor faces at the time of the action.

    As we cannot know the contents of the minds of either participant (nor can the participants know the minds of eachother) "intent" is not the relevant model for this discussion.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (1 child)

    YOU'RE NOT A LAWYER.

    I don't care what the hell you read dude lmfao you've been running around with your chatgpt ass answers thinking you're right and saying shit that you then contradict yourself with.

    Remember when you said intent didn't matter? Justification did? Fucking idiot.

    Remember when you said she committed ASSAULT!!! and his actions were "questionable" and then it made you sad he kicked her?

    You're fucking stupid. Shut up and stop defending this man who absolutely committed assault three goddamn times.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago

    Remember when you said intent didn’t matter? Justification did? Fucking idiot.

    Yes. I do. And I stand by that, as I have explained.

    Remember when you said she committed ASSAULT!!! and his actions were “questionable” and then it made you sad he kicked her?

    Indeed. I remember both. And I remember that I've addressed every concern you've raised about those conclusions.

    chatgpt

    While I am reasonably certain that nobody reading along would actually think my comments are from chatgpt, I feel compelled to specifically deny that any of my published comments have been generated by any sort of LLM. The closest I have come to an LLM is the image of a rabbit with a "cigar cutter" I use as an avatar. I seem to recall criticizing various AI works in the past, and may have quoted or attached examples here on lemmy or in other media, but any such use would clearly delineate my content from any AI content. I cannot guarantee that external links I have provided are entirely devoid of AI content.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (11 children)
  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (10 children)
  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (7 children)

    Funny seeing you in here pointing fingers at others. There are more people out there that recognize misogyny than myself.

    Are you defending the guy in the video as well?

    Love that I live rent free in your head <3

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (6 children)

    Oh, hi. Last time I've seen your comments you got banned so I thought that maybe you changed accounts. This person just gives off the same vibe (attacking blindly everyone expressing opinion that deviates from theirs).

    If you care about my opinion on the video (haha, I'm sure you don't) I see a drunk, disgusting man and a lady that vastly overestimates her fighting abilities. His behavior is inexcusable but what the fuck is she doing? If this was a bear she would be dead.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    Flight, fight, freeze, or fawn are all involuntary reactions to being in danger.

    They're not attacking people blindly. They're reacting to the blatant misogyny on display here from people defending this man's actions.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    Flight, fight, freeze, or fawn are all involuntary reactions to being in danger.

    Yes and no. There are involuntary reactions in the face of danger (like increased blood flow, muscle tension, dilated pupils etc.) but people don't start fighting involuntarily. Maybe you're confusing it with startle response which is involuntary? In fight-or-flight response there's a moment of assessment (hence dilated pupils, to let you see better) and the response is a conscious one. People don't involuntarily get up, grab a beer bottle and advance threateningly towards danger as part of fight-or-flight.

    Now you can call me a misogynist for thinking that people remain conscious in dangerous situations.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago* (3 children)

    I don’t need to say anything when you’re inventing my arguments against you and erroneously accusing others of being me.

    I hope you think of me every time you see a criticism of a sexist comment on the internet just as you did here.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    accusing others of being me.

    Come one, "accusing"? It's not like being you is wrong or something.

    I hope you think of me every time you see a criticism of a sexist comment on the internet just as you did here.

    It's not as much about criticizing sexism as it's about insulting everyone with a different opinion without providing any arguments or engaging in a reasonable discussion but yes, I will definitely think of you every time I see it.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 child)

    You’ve made it clear that you think being compared to me is an insult.

    While I appreciate deft’s approach in this thread, this is exactly how I know you’re boxing ghosts when you fight me. I don’t name call and I provide solid arguments backed up with sources when I’m not dealing with trolling behavior.

    Continue hallucinating about me <3

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago* (1 child)

    I ignored this comment because I didn't know what the hell you were talking about but now I realize you're just a fuckin idiot.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago

    Of course I am. You're the only smart person here. We're so lucky to be blessed by your high IQ comments like "Are you a moron?", "you’re just a fuckin idiot" or "Moron shit to say". You're truly the ray of wisdom in this land of intellectual darkness. In the name of the whole lemmy community: thank you for being here.

  • source
  • parent