captain_aggravated comments on ‘I don’t want to be part of a dictatorship’: the Americans queueing up to renounce their citizenship

[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (13 children)

If they were MY ally they'd stay and fight. They aren't. They never have been.

If you leave, you have left and are not welcome back. I'll be no ally to anyone who won't turn and fight alongside me. Those fleeing intend to use me as a meat shield.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago (12 children)

Those fleeing intend not to be your human shield.

If there are vulnerable people at risk of violence, and you're privileged enough not to be in danger, then you should be that human shield. Otherwise you aren't an ally, and then expect those most at risk to risk themselves further to protect you.

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 points 6 months ago (11 children)

Let's be clear here: We're talking about fighting fascism. Nobody is privileged enough to not be in danger under fascism. Nobody. Not the conscientious objectors, not the "but I voted for you"s, not the dictators inner circle, not school girls in another hemisphere.

I don't have time to bicker about who is farther up their "others to exterminate" list. This ain't the oppression olympics, it's World War 3. To everyone but LGBTQ, allyhood is mutual.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 0 points 6 months ago (10 children)

You seem to expect and even demand that affected minorities stay and protect your comfort.

This country failed them, they fear for their safety and even lives. and you're upset they aren't staying to fix it?

It isn't a "oppression Olympics" it is people fleeing for their safety. And maybe when we fix things, they could return.

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 point 6 months ago (9 children)

No. No they could not return. I will fight them. The United States of America is the home of the brave. Cowards are not welcome here. If you're not willing to fight for America, why would I ever let you return? What use do I have for such fair weather friends? To those who flee: Good riddance to bad rubbish.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago (8 children)

From this conversation, you are the rubbish that makes people flee for their safety.

Minorities fearing for their safety aren't your pawns. you're a bigot, the racists kind. the kind that says to refugees fleeing for their lives to go back to where they come from, while ignoring it is thanks to voters like you that they have to flee.

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 0 points 6 months ago (7 children)

When foreigners apply to become naturalized as American citizens, they are required to take the following oath:

"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God."

We have a domestic enemy from whom to defend the constitution. Anyone who refuses that fight, instead renouncing their citizenship and fleeing, proves for all time they are unworthy to take this oath, and thus unworthy of citizenship.

Those who leave shall not be permitted to return.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago (6 children)

That oath means ziltch, as they are made to do so under duress. "SAY THIS WE WILL WITHHOLD RIGHTS AND BENEFITS FROM YOU AND RISK REMOVING YOU FROM YOUR HOME AND COMMUNITY". So it does not count as an "oath", and everyone else in this country has not made it anyways.

This state has betrayed the people who need to flee. Why the fuck do they owe that state? A state that objectively treated them like shit. Did it provide healthcare? a good education? Justice? and now it actively tries to hurt them?

They do not owe us shit. especially you. I wish they were safe here, but because that wish has been denied already, I wish their escape is as safe and easy as possible. And then I wish things get better so they could return to their communities.

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

Why the fuck do they owe that state?

They don't. Our duty is not to the state; our duty is to the Constitution. To support and defend The Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic." Really chew on that sentence, savor the flavor, especially those last two words. That's a flavor that comes in boxes. ~~ Four~~ five boxes. You don't seem to understand that. Probably because you're not actually American.

You don't want to be an American citizen? You may leave. Renouncing your citizenship, you fill out the paperwork that says "I am no longer a citizen of the United States" you're done. You aren't coming back. We won't re-naturalize you. You have to apply to take that oath. Your application will be denied.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago (4 children)

are you?

Are you fighting to protect them? are you putting yourself where your mouth is?

if people are fleeing for their safety, we are in that fascism, it is a tyrannical government, are you fighting to protect the constitution? or are you only being a bigot to people who value life over your personal emotions.

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 2 points 6 months ago (3 children)

I seem to be doing a hell of a lot more than you.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (2 children)

Go on?

Tell me?

Mutual aids? organise? set up ICE watch? rapid response training? street medic training? Sabotage Flock cameras? Offered your house to your at risk neighbors if ICE goes door to door? Food delivery to migrants who are afraid to leave their house? Canvassed for progressive candidates?

Or you think being racist online is enough for your American sense of duty?

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 0 points 6 months ago (1 child)

I haven't condemned myself to helplessness out of some entitled sense of designated victimhood. You can start there.

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[–] IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world 1 point 6 months ago

Great, you admitting not doing fuck all, the government is tyrannical and going after your neighbors, you let that happen, then when they flee for their lives your upset they did stay back and protect you?

If they can stay and fight, they would be fighting you.

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