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Classic ungrateful Brenda (lemmy.world)
submitted 6 months ago by to c/memes@lemmy.world
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[–] 15 points 6 months ago (12 children)

It is a myth, that men were the only ones hunting, so maybe it needs a different explanation.

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  • [–] 8 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    Also one of the defining traits of our species is our propensity to try varied means of social organization. To act like hunter gatherer H. sapiens were all modeling their societies the same way in regards to gendered division of labor flies in the face of what has been observed in the historical and archeological records.

    The Dawn of Everything goes heavily into this and is a fascinating book

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    @captainlezbian @laughingsquirrel this is quite interestingMay read that eventually (if I finish my other books)

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  • [–] -3 points 6 months ago (7 children)

    This is the third paragraph from the article you provided "Researchers found the female body was better suited for endurance activity...."

    Which is what my explanation is based on

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  • [–] 8 points 6 months ago (6 children)

    Humans were persistence hunters which requires endurance. Lots of strength isn’t really necessary when the prey has exhausted itself.

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  • [–] -2 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    Im not gonna continue further, already made too many people "angry". Somehow this convo became about humans being hunters and what not. And not the original conversation about dishes and dragons.

    My whole point was about women having different physiology than men. Please fight the scientists who are researching this, not me.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    Your comment did frustrate me at first but I do think you were trying to have a legitimate discussion on the topic and not trolling. I’ve been on that end of a conversation before and it’s discouraging.

    Your point about physiology isn’t necessarily wrong but I would point out that different types hunting would be better suited for different genders.

    • If you need to be able to chase down your prey, women are better suited for cardio and endurance.

    • If you need to overpower your prey, men are traditionally more suited.

    I’m guessing which gender did what was probably completely dependent on the prey available in your specific ecosystem, along with local culture.

    But referring back to the original topic, both men and women are capable of care-taking or providing for their family. That’s backed up by archeological studies like this one.

    Women, such as myself, are likely frustrated by your questions because many men in our lives use this type of argument as an excuse to avoid responsibility. Because this is a text based forum, I think we miss the body language that would come with your trying to ask an earnest question and automatically assume the worst.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    Yes very true. Body language is super important in conversations like this.

    For me what felt strange is that, I am a propnent of sharing household responsibilities between men and women equally. So basically equality despite difference in capability. But then, when it comes to society in general, I don't believe in equal responsibility ie rich and privilegded ppl should have more responsibility than underprivileged. And this makes me feel like a hypocrite you know?

    On one example, I am thinking of equality and the other proportionality.

    I guess my idealogy is still incomplete.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (2 children)

    I was not angry with my original reply, it could jot in anyway be reasonably taken as angry. I am however a bit frustrated now, in particular with your response to me. To quote what you said,

    “Somehow this convo became about humans being hunters and what not. And not the original conversation about dishes and dragons.”

    To also quote you’re first comment you said,

    “Isn't this how we function evolutionarily? Like in a hunter and gatherers society, men were predominantly the ones required to do "one-hit" labour like hunting, whereas women were predominantly the ones doing "continual" labour like gathering food.”

    You are the one who brought it up. Saying it “somehow” came up like you did is disingenuous and implies my argument is unrelated and can therefore be dismissed.

    That is what is now making me a bit frustrated and why I felt it necessary to clear up the way you misconstrued things in your reply to me.

    You are free to not respond if you do not want to. If you don’t want to continue I will respect that.

    I also want to make sure that everyone reading this understands that them not replying or wanting to end the discussion should not be taken to mean anything one way or another.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    I feel bad for making you frustrated. It wasn't my intention. I think these text based format just makes things weird for us. You sound like someone I could have had a nice conversation on this topic without frustrations if we were discussing IRL.

    For what its worth, my original intent was to discuss different approaches to distribution of labour rather than talking about hunter gatherer society. I have weird way of talking where i can't help but justify my reasoning, so hunters gatherer was the justification for different physiology. And different physiology was the setup for the discussion on distribution of labour.

    What I found strange about myself is that I (and so many others including you) believe in equal distribution of labour in household despite having different physiology. But I support proportional distribution of labour when it comes broader society ie rich and priviledge should contribute more than poor and underpriviledged.

    And I kinda find this strange about myself (also generally) that we have different views when looking at society versus household.

    If i make a claim that we can't know actual capability between a couple therefore equal distribution of labour is fair then a similar argument can be made about rich vs poor.

    Anyways, I have a bad habit of making everything too political, this is a meme community so maybe i need to dial down that political side of me.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    I think the heart of the difference between our views from what I’ve been able to understand from you is this. You view biological differences between men and women as having a sufficient enough reason to support gender roles if in the event the capability of a couple is known.

    I view the biological differences as something that should only be considered from a health perspective I.e. crash test dummy’s designed for men and ones designed for women to ensure proper safety testing.

    For me the biological differences shouldn’t be considered whether we know a couple’s capabilities or not. Humans are an extremely varied species with lots of overlap between women and men.

    There are women who are tall and muscular and men who are short and skinny. There are men who are tall and skinny and women who are short and muscular.

    Ultimately the biggest factor is lifestyle and not genetics. A female firefighter could absolutely out strength many males even if she’s short because she works out regularly.

    In short I don’t think biological differences are significant enough to be taken into actual consideration outside of specific circumstances like described above. While you as I understand it do believe them to be significant enough a factor to be given consideration if the differences between a couple are known.

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