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Is it already 5? (lemmy.zip)
submitted 9 months ago by to c/whitepeopletwitter@sh.itjust.works
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[–] 5 points 9 months ago* (4 children)

Not to make you second guess yourself but it always trips me up when people say they know that there is no post death experience. It seem gnostic.

The shrooms statement could be true for some perspectives and is impossible to proof either way. The idea can be used practically, to understand that death is nothing to worry about and even comfortable can make it easier to live life in the moment. But i have no idea why a healthy person would seek it out because it’l happen on its own for everyone anyway. Might as well live out the magic of this reality now as i experience it.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (3 children)

    Not to make you second guess yourself but it always trips me up when people say they know that there is no post death experience. It seem gnostic.

    I hate to break it to ya, but I've tried Chaos Magick, Buddhism, Christianity, and New Age... and all the time, it felt like I was lying to myself. That I was desprately clinging on because I was so afraid of death. But the truth is, there is no God.

    I really want there to be a God, but our universe is well documented and contains no sign of design or purpose. Life was not created, it evolved, and I'm not so sure it was a good idea to develop conciousness. What cruelty is it to give life to something that knows it is destined to die, the universe is a harsh mistress.

    Mankind has dreamed of a light we go into after death, to seek an even greater purpose and fulfillment than we had in life, but it is just a dream. Neurology has proven conciousness is all in the brain, once the brain goes, so do you. How I wish I could live the "life" of a spirit, unattached from the world and unable to be harmed by it; free to go where I want and do what I will.

    Believing in magic made sense in the Bronze Age, but in the modern day we have measured and labeled the things of the world, and not a drop of that inventory includes the mystical.

    I wish I could offer an empty platitude about how life has more meaning because it's finite, or how the wonders of the natural world are good enough. I'd be lying if I did however.

    The Universe is eternal, matter and energy are never truly created or destroyed, it merely changes form. Our conciousness however, is an exception to this, it started when we were born and it will end with our death. The universe is eternal, but we are temporary.

    I take no joy in telling you this, but it is a horror that we must learn to accept.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago* (2 children)

    No worried, i am agnostic, spiritual but not at all religious.

    I wouldn’t recommend to put much actual trust in any of the human myths you previously studied

    I am asking because, i find it noteworthy that within atheism you are still clinging to gnosticism.

    Gnostic means you believe something and seem absolutely certain about it.

    Agnostic means you are inclined to believe some things, under the knowledge that you could be wrong.

    When you say you know how most of the universe is infinite, but then consciousness is without any actual proof an exception to this, then i would interpret that as a religious belief of some kind.

    Anyway there are a near infinite ways to interpret reality. To me everything appears emerged from a singular point that factually expanded into many smaller things that can then interact with eachother, from which more interactions emerge till at some point all possible interactions between all possible things have occurred. I call this maximalisation of reality and it came from the tough experiment of if i had infinite space, time and knowledge what would do with it all. The answer was to experience that all. Good, bad, no judgement or goal, just all.

    You don't need to concern yourself with that neither do i suggest you take it as truth but you seem like an open minded person and i think the concept of agnostic spirituality could serve as an inspiration to enhance your view of life without having to pick a fixed truth you cant deviate from.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    The problem with being agnostic, is that there really isn't any reason to be.

    There is no room for anything supernatural in any model of the universe that is taken seriously.

    The field of Parapsychology has existed for over a hundred years and has never produced any results that cannot be explained by fraud, chance, or experimental error.

    The field of Creation Science has existed for half as long and yet institutions that claim to represent it have no data that comes anywhere near to poking a hole in evolution, justifying a young earth, or most importantly providing any evidence for the hypothesis that the world seems designed by an omnipotent creator.

    Instead they just cherry pick qoutes from real scientists and go "naw uh"

    We consistently see that anyone with a supernatural explanation for anything in the universe is a charlatan at worst or naive at best.

    This is consistent.

    Everytime someone tries to prove God they use the same three arguments which fail every time.

    1. Arguing that creation must have a creator - We can demonstrate that the world doesn't need a creator nor does it appear designed

    2. Arguing that morals come from God - Morals do not come from God, one is perfectly able to have morality without God. The morality we have is not even consistent with what the Bible teaches as the Bible says Slavery is good and so is Misogyny, yet in every developed nation people tend to think these are not ideals one should strive for.

    My morality is very subjective. It is based on the idea that causing harm is wrong, unless

    The act of harm creates a greater good than not harming another. This includes forcing medication on someone who needs it but doesn't want it or defending oneself from an attacker. While my premise "Do no harm" seems objective, the exceptions are subjective. And there must be exceptions because Do No Harm is itself wrong in specific scenarios.

    1. It is written in a sacred text that references real world history - 9/11 is a canon event in the Marvel Universe and New York is a real place, yet we do not see support for Thor's existence.

    I would love for the spiritual to be true, but unfortunately the supernatural is a non-starter and admitting that is just a part of growing up.

    I see a lot of myself in you friend. I too desperately clinged to an agnostic world view, hoping materialism was wrong and that if I just kept an open mind the wonders of the spiritual would appear before me.

    I hate to say it, but you don't walk away with a smile on your face at the end of the rainbow.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago*

    I am not sure what you are saying and i don’t think you know what i am saying but i too see alot of myself within you somehow

    I am not arguing for a god or any supernatural, like i said i am not religious. I also don't feel like i am desperately hoping materialism is wrong. I might have years ago.

    I do not believe there is an objective good or bad. And if there is a god they are not concerned with morals.

    Most of my theory came from grounded observation. You can probably find yourself agreeing with these. They are just a list of statements though, i hope you don’t mind.

    The universe is big that from my frame of reference i can only understand it as infinite.

    The universe is full of information (everything is information)

    Humans only know a fraction of this information

    when scientists look at the sky they continue to perceive unexplained phenomena.

    I will never know all The secrets of science and we continue to discover things though impossible before.

    Any advanced enough technology becomes Indistinguishable from magic.

    From this i hope Its enough to say, A human being does not have the capacity to comprehend the complexity of all reality. Everything we think we know Is an approximation of truth and we can always be wrong, always learn more.

    I heavily dislike assuming something is not real just because it seem that way from my perspective, i am just some silly ape. What do i know about the value of life, evil or what science may one day make possible or discover. Sometimes i can’t even tell i am dreaming in my sleep.

    I don’t believe there is an end of the rainbow. Smiling in this case is a matter of choice

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