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Americans with six-figure incomes are in 'survival mode' (www.usatoday.com)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/nottheonion@lemmy.world
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[–] 12 points 11 months ago (24 children)

You can’t afford to buy a single family home on $100k/yr in my area. So I’m not sure it really meets the classic definition of middle class anymore.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (4 children)

    Middle class didn’t mean a big McMansion or desirable area. It meant a modest house in a small lot in a boring suburb of someplace like Detroit where you’d work for Ford or something.

    Our ideas of what kind of house we should have is really distorted. It’s like pickup trucks. What was considered an everyday pickup 40 years ago was 1/3rd the size of the behemoths available today, and of course today’s trucks cost $80,000 compared to the $6,500 of something like a ‘85 Toyota Pickup ($20k in today dollars).

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (3 children)

    Every 1950s 1k square foot track home in my area is 1 million or more no matter how dilapidated within 2hours of the metro

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    “Desirable area”

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  • [+] -7 points 11 months ago (18 children)

    Lots of homes are easily affordable with that income. Buy elsewhere.

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  • [–] 8 points 11 months ago (10 children)

    Show me the place where you can both earn the $100k AND afford the homes. Places with higher wages also have higher costs. It doesn’t help someone in Seattle to tell them go buy a home in Oklahoma.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (9 children)

    There's quite a few major cities in the US where houses are averaging around 300k which a 100k salary would easily cover the purchase of. Pittsburg, Detroit, Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Madison, Minneapolis, Indianapolis, St Louis for examples just off the top of my head. And if you look in rural areas between these major cities you can easily snag a 100k home so if you ever find yourself burnt out from your high paying career there's that option too

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (8 children)

    Sure but that doesn’t say anything about the wages there. How many $100k jobs am I going to find in Milwuakee and Detroit? I work in tech so I can tell you now the answer is close to zero.

    This source says that median household income in Pittsburgh is in the low $60ks. And while housing costs are 2% below national average, utility costs are 20% above national average 🤷‍♂️

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (7 children)

    How many $100k jobs am I going to find in Milwuakee and Detroit?

    These are literally major cities with populations measured in the millions. There's plenty of high paying jobs to be had. And the best part is, since home prices aren't measured in the millions you can survive on a lower income.

    Also I work in tech too. I've interviewed for jobs making $80-120k in some of the listed cities. I know people making over 100k in some of the listed cities. Median income is just that, the median. Some people are going to make more and some people are going to make less. Highly skilled workers in any major city will make high pay. Sure you might shave off 10-20% from your expected wage in your sector in a lower cost of living city but your housing costs will likely be literally be half or a third of that when compared to LA, New York City or the San Francisco Bay Area, plus with that lower cost of living comes more options if you become burnt out from your highly paid and likely high stress job, you can afford to jump ship and change careers

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (6 children)

    I’m sorry, I just don’t buy your argument that “it’s a major city.” I gave you an actual statistic and you brushed it aside in favor of notions like “there are millions of people there,” and you’ve met some outliers.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (5 children)

    Okay lets dig into some BLS data then!

    Since you brought up Pittsburgh, one of the largest cities in Pennsylvania let's look at the Occupational Employment and Wage Statistics for Pennsylvania in 2024

    • Web developers in Pennsylvania make a median annual salary of $92,930, and the 75th percentile make an annual salary of $117,000 which oh look is over 100k
    • Network and Computer Systems Administrators make a median salary of $94,420 and the 75th percentile make an annual salary of $104,210 which again oh look is over 100k
    • Database Administrators make a median annual salary of $105,100
    • Data Scientists make a median annual salary of $107,450

    Is that too tech heavy?

    • Funeral home managers make a median annual salary of $100,080
    • Transportation, Storage, and Distribution Managers make a median salary of $119,550
    • Clinical and Counseling Psychologists make a median salary of $103,980
    • Pharmacists make a median salary of $133,720

    And because I listed the two largest cities in Wisconsin lets look at Wisconsin quickly as well:

    • Web developers in Wisconsin make a median annual salary of $92,930, and the 75th percentile salary is $117,000 which oh look is over 100k
    • Software Developers make a median annual salary of $114,030
    • Computer Programmers make a median annual salary of $104,080

    Too tech heavy?

    • Farmers, Ranchers, and Other Agricultural Managers make a media salary of $92,790 with a 75th percentile salary of $104,430
    • Human Resources Managers make a median salary of $148,000 with a 10th percentile salary of $93,450 (so its not just super-high earners skewing the data, by the way the 90th percentile is $213,680)
    • Veterinarians make a median salary of $118,030
    • Pharmacists make a median salary of $141,090
    • Air Traffic Controllers make only a median salary of $108,330 (which is shockingly low for how famously high-stress of a career that is!)

    And lets just for the heck of it look at Montana!

    • Sales Managers make a median salary of $138,210
    • Software Developers make a median salary of $120,950
    • Data Scientists make a median salary of $111,490

    So my point still stands, looking at states with much lower cost of living and highly skilled professions are still highly compensated, many folks well above 100k/year

    Oh and before you bring up the median salary for all occupations in these states being 60k (an amount firmly in the middle class that you can live comfortably off of in these states) the median salary in New York and California, states with famously unaffordable housing in their cities, the median salaries are only $80k and good luck getting a house in these cities at that salary!

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (4 children)

    You’re attempting to make a long and carefully formatted post look like a convincing argument, but all you’ve done is cherry pick high wage occupations. You are simply showing again and again that you cannot contend with a topic in terms of aggregate metrics and will do anything to skew the picture to match some picture you have an emotional attachment to.

    If we’re going to cherry pick, shit, I earn over $500k in one of these HCOL areas you say are such pressure cookers. My house is nearly paid off. I guess this is a great area for families to move to, right???

    I’ll say one thing… I never have to work so hard to justify where I live as you have here.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (3 children)

    Show me the place where you can both earn the $100k AND afford the homes

    That was your original comment. I listed off major cities with decent supplies of housing stock available below 500k

    You responded

    How many $100k jobs am I going to find in Milwuakee and Detroit?

    As well as pointing out that

    median household income in Pittsburgh is in the low $60k

    I pointed out that major cities tend to have high paying jobs available for highly skilled workers. You specified working in tech and demanded real world data, so I provided real wage data showing tech jobs and highly skilled jobs paying over 100k and in the interest of fairness I included some where the median isn't a full 100k but many workers in that field do make over 100k.

    So in conclusion, I listed off major cities where one can both make 100k and afford homes. Let's not move the goal posts anymore please.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (2 children)

    Exactly one comment earlier, we have you stating your case as a broad generalization:

    Lots of homes are *easily* affordable with that income. Buy elsewhere.

    Now you want to claim that as long as the 99.99th percentile can satisfy your claim, it’s valid. Who’s moving the goalposts, here?

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (6 children)

    Yes... but you have to choose more slum-y areas. And if you have kids, they're gonna get buillied so much.

    Source, I am that kid. Moved from Brooklyn to Philly, sure, housing was more affordable, but school ratings went from 8/10 to like a 3/10. Such hell.

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  • [+] -7 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    you have to choose more slum-y areas

    Here is a random home I found after only a few seconds of looking. 3 bedroom home in Colorado Springs for $265k. Easily affordable at the stated $100k/yr income.

    You can’t afford to buy a single family home on $100k/yr in my area.

    you have to choose more slum-y areas

    Lots of homes are easily affordable with that income. Buy elsewhere.

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  • [–] 8 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Cmon, you can’t cherry pick a house and say “just uproot your entire life, there are cheaper houses out there!”

    Schools, job market, support system and more all play a huge part. It isn’t as simple as “just move.”

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  • [–] 7 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    The thing is though that unless you have a fully remote job you are probably not going to stay earning 100k in colarado springs

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago

    There's the additional cost that my whole family and all my friends live in the "Greater Seattle area" where housing is outrageous and climbing. If I were to move somewhere more affordable it would mean losing my entire social support system.

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