I laughed when Milton Friedman thinks free market could prevent climate change through climate dividends and carbon tax. Good luck, boyo, your "greed is good" bullshit is what led us to here.
post
What I never understand is, do the billionaires not care about their own children? Or tbh even themselves at this point as it's happening so fast even they will be affected (although they can probably mitigate the effects by moving to one of their 500 houses that's in a safe zone)
although they can probably mitigate the effects by moving to one of their 500 houses that's in a safe zone
That's why they don't care.
Climate change hits the poorest first and hardest (see: hurricanes in the Caribbean and SEA).
Billionaires can fly in, enjoy the sunshine, fly out and not get a drop of water on their skin.
And they'll keep "outrunning" climate change on an individual level, and only feel it when it hurts their net worth*.
*
At which point, they'll just re-organize their investments to exploit clean energy subsidies and real estate wherever everyone is fleeing to when the coasts flood.
do the billionaires not care about their own children?
Ummm...no? I sincerely believe some people are inherently evil. Look at Elon Musk and how he treats his children.
I was watching a documentary on the nature of evil. There is an incarcerated serial killer who acknowledges what he did is evil and wrong, but he doesn't feel empathy. CT scan of his brain showed that the part of the brain associated with empathy is not really active. Having said that, I heard that the longer someone is in power, the more that their brain physiologically changes.
Of course it is more complicated and nurture still plays a role on the person's development, but I think sometimes nature is stronger.
They have bunkers, they have stockpiles of food and medicine, and they have staff to maintain it all. They fully believe they have the means and resources to insulate themselves from all consequences.
If we dont get rid of capitalism, rich will be the last one to be affected by climate change. Proletariat is as shield for them to face wrath of climate change first
I get this is a meme, but it is trying to talk about something serious. It's worth saying that fatalist arguments are actually beneficial to liberalism and capitalism. Capitalism is not going to kill us all, humans are exceptionally durable. Capitalism intends to kill us all though, whether through the dehumanization it requires to function or its inability to contend with the material limitations of reality. Climate change mitigation is a discussion around minimising the harm this system causes while it dies, and liberals often subscribe to fatalist narratives because they dont truly imagine a world that is not capitalist as one worth living in.
Calling a country where the means of production are controlled by the upper classes "socialist" is a stretch even before we consider their mixed economy and rampant capitalism.
Saying the public has ownership implies that they have some control of it which certainly isn't true. It's more like a Palace economy than anything.
Capitalism will make the earth uninhabitable. That will kill us all. If you care about the future, you are thinking about how to murder an oligarch.
Any other kind of 'planning' for the future is delusional clown shit. Just chill the fuck out and do unreasonable amounts of drugs.
No, Capitalism will not make the Earth uninhabitable. It will kill very many things the longer it is part of our world, but you are subscribing to a liberal fatalist narrative that constructs the future as definitively destroyed because it does not resemble the world we live in. It's doomer shit that is painfully white.
How you got, "we don't need to end capitalism" I have no responsibility for. If I say it isnt infinitely powerful but must end as quickly as possible, what exactly do you think I'm advocating for?
Oh you're just basing everything on wishful thinking and vibes. Okay.
My brother in Christ, you people are talking about capitalism as though it were a god. Have none of you seriously thought about like, doing something even when the world is less livable? Do you think everyone will just lay down and die because the world isn't as nice as it is today?
This is not "wishful." This is fucking reality. Right this moment, you are working on a fantasy that is only appealing to settlers who would rather die than live in a world they are not comfortable in.
So fucking tired of liberals here insisting that people should die because they only pretend to want to give up this way of life.
You're talking about earth as if its a guarantee, not an incredibly fragile complicated thing.
Best case scenario, we fix everything today², the next century or three is going to be rougher than you can really imagine. If it's not already too late to salvage-and it may be; we don't know for sure. Every moment we stay on this course things get worse. There's a lot we dont understand and every new revelation seems to amount to us being more fucked than we thought.
We cannot fix anything before killing most/all of the oligarchs. They wont let us. No amount of cutting back and going green and switching to passive systems with society built around vegan electric trains matters a single fuck while oligarchs are still poisoning every option and building new coal plants to power the machine that murders truth. Portions of the planet are already becoming uninhabitable.
Your insults are nonsense. You are not serious. Your hysterical climate denialism is an unwillingness to choose between killing the fuckers making the problem so the rest of us can crack down and fix our shit, or a graceful death. You're disgusting insistence that I kill myself¹ while insisting 'I'm not doing that and that my slave morality should be coddled' is absolutely devoid of virtue. Kill yourself if you like, but don't insist that those who dont are random words people called you in a mean voice, shitlib.
¹the current plan. Hence the drugs. I don't love any of you enough to die violently for a world I'm not gonna see unless i think the rest of you would follow through, and you wouldn't.
²go real hard on walkability and electric trains. Cars straight up get disassembled where they're currently parked and scrapped via cargo bike. Meat is off the shelves. No more commercial flights. No more disposable bullshit. Every spare hand to reclamation and remediation projects. Everything switched over to passive systems in all new construction. Maybe no more concrete.
I actually had to read all of that because I cannoy believe someone is this intentionally misunderstanding. You seriously have to actually read about the shit you talk about because your usable knowledge is obviously very slim despite your confidence.
You are fighting people who are not in this comment thread. Not only did I never say capitalists (no, not "oligarchs" like this is about individuals and not a system) should not be killed, I asked you to actually think about why youre making this incomprehensible assumption in the context of my comments. What do you think I mean when I say capitalism is both fragile and an immediate threat? Slave morality? You're not even talking about anything at that point; it's so contained to your own misunderstanding of what has been said here.
It is incredible to hear someone so dedicated to the settler way of life call me a lib. Blocked.
You're right, capitalism won't make the Earth completely uninhabitable. Many mass extinction events have occurred in our planet's past, and life has always eventually recovered (obviously).
However, capitalism will destroy our planet's ability to sustain our society, and eventually our species, and it is doing so at an alarming rate. To disagree, at this point, is to ignore an amout of scientific evidence so substantial, it amounts similarly to denying the Earth is round.
My god, three of you who won't read. I'm just going to block you after this because this is getting silly.
Yes, I said that at least five times throughout this thread. My exact criticism is that liberals subscribe to fatalist narratives because they cannot or will not imagine an alternative to this society. Nowhere anywhere in this thread did I suggest climate change is not destructive.
The amount of you who cannot seperate these ideas is itself proof of what my comment argues. It is literally incomprehensible to you to accept climate change's existence as well as the reality of living in a world that will be changed because of it. Fatalist narratives appropriate scientific evidence in the service of reproducing the social conditions that have facilitated climate change.
A world less livable is one worth living in, but to those of you who would rather die than change, there is no such thing as a less livable world, just the destruction of this one.
Fuck's sake with the liberals on this site. Fucking develop some humility before you assume you know everything.
I can read just fine. You're asserting that climate change should be embraced because we'll learn to "live with it." I'm pointing out that you're ignoring a giant mountain of evidence that says the best case scenario is that ten percent of our species survives. So, if we're understanding each other correctly, ninety percent of humans dying is the "new normal" you're saying we should be cool with, and I'm not cool with that.
I just realized you're from .ml. Please block me, I can't stand you assholes anyway.
Someone's got their head buried in the sand. The number of critical problems that are gonna come to a head in the next 20 years that could collectively degrade the biosphere beyond supporting a substantial human population is nuts. It's not fatalist to say that billions could die and it's no consolation to the dead and their loved ones that "humans are exceptionally durable".
Wow, two pompous dudes who assume they know everything but don't even bother to read.
Nothing you just talked about was said by me. Doomer shit, as in saying "all life will end" or even "all human life will end," is in fact liberal, settler, bs. It presumes that a world that is not conducive to human life as it exists is not one worth imagining and especially not building. It is a convenient dead end that absolves you of the responsibility to participate in mitigation and reconstruction because, of course, it's too late and even if it isn't it will be and capitalism is powerful enough to apparently sustain a collapse of supply chains. It is foolish.
Nowhere did I say people won't die, I emphasised that they do and actually value the lives of people who will more than some dude who does fucking nothing because I at least recognize that there is a way to mitigate the amount of people who do die. Additionally, I acknowledged that this is not limited to human life. Capitalism will not destroy all life on this planet, this is straight up reality. No, human systems are not equal in power to fucking cosmic events.
Capitalism does try to survive despite the obvious reality that a system dependent on infinite resources cannot exist in a finite material world. It will do so by killing more and more life until it dies, and it will die whether that is from human action itself or the eventuality of a world that refuses to sustain its existence through environmental change and yes, the collapse of crucial ecosystems.
I say humans are durable because we are, do you have any fucking clue how insane this way of life is in the context of life on this planet? Do you have any idea how close humans have come to extinction in the past exactly because of ecological change? You don't, you refuse to because all of that is terribly inconvenient for someone who doesn't want life to change.
Grow up and help. I won't read a response as it's obvious you didn't grant me that level of respect.
Humans are have been killing each other over pettiest things for millenia before capitalism. So an ~ism is not the root problem
'An ism'. This fucking folkism pretention can fuck right off. You dont even know the word for the thing you're talking about.
Climate change goes beyond killing each other; it's killing our planet's ability to sustain our species.
I replied before checking instance; they're .world. Not really human. No point in arguing.
Okay, let me lay out my thought to you in a longer and more boring way: humans have been idiots with no regard to consequences of their actions throughout their history, so anyone interested in fixing any problem caused by how they act has to replace current population with more evolved (read: mature, intelligent and sensible) one, there can be no other way and wasting time on anger against this or that social framework is very foolish
It sounds like you're saying the only way to better a society is to replace all its members with ones who already agree with you. If so, I'm not real sure how to help you. Good luck with that.
Where did I say I want people who agree with me? I want more sensible people, and they are sure to disagree with me on lots of things. Buut good luck with your putting words in mouth of other people, if you want to have this conversation this way
Ok then, it sounds like you think the only way to improve society is to replace its members with ones who are "more sensible," as defined by you. Sorry, but I'm not sure how to help you with that one either.
Buddy has a USSR ghost as his profile picture, I think he has a bone to pick with capitalism specifically.
all 61 comments