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I’ve already been using a “Steam Machine” for months, and I think it’s great (arstechnica.com)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/steamdeck@sopuli.xyz
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[–] 52 points 1 year ago (21 children)

The benefit of Steam Machine:

  1. HDMI-CEC
  2. Wake on Bluetooth
  3. Sleep/Resume
  4. Background updates
  5. Efficiency/Noise/Heat
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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago* (2 children)

    Haha, benefits of a computer is that it is a computer.

    Wait, is CEC rare thing? Does Linux lack specific support for modern GPUs?
    It's been a long time since I've tried CEC on non-Pi computer.

    Wake on IR or USB is def a thing, but it isn't via BT?

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (13 children)

    Most of that will be available with SteamOS in general I assume, and also probably, with packages, on any Linux distro. It's really only HDMI-CEC and wake on Bluetooth that are somewhat exclusive. I don't know how hard it is to build/add HDMI-CEC into a computer, but maybe that isn't even exclusive. Wake on Bluetooth, I assume, requires some special hardware to support it, which I don't think will be available or easily added to other computers.

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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (12 children)

    Most of that will be available with SteamOS in general I assume

    No need to assume. I run SteamOS on my personal machine and don't have any of these features. These are all hardware features.

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  • [–] -2 points 11 months ago* (11 children)

    Sleep/resume, background updates, and efficiency/noise/heat are not hardware features.

    Every computer has sleep/resume.

    Background updates is a software-based idle mode. It reduces what's running to the bare minimum and only runs a check for updates/the updater occasionally.

    Efficiency/noise/heat are all the same thing and has little to do with the hardware. The hardware they're using isn't any more efficient than what you can buy yourself. The software is possibly more efficient (for the Deck it is at least) to reduce power draw/heat/thermal throttling/noise. However, you can get the same yourself with Arch, only installing what you need. It's not exclusive to Valve.

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago (10 children)

    Every computer has sleep/resume.

    Try it on your desktop in the middle of a game and let me know how that goes.

    Background updates is a software-based idle mode.

    It's not, it requires a special processor.

    Efficiency/noise/heat are all the same thing and has little to do with the hardware.

    Uhhh it has EVERYTHING to do with the hardware?

    The hardware they're using isn't any more efficient than what you can buy yourself.

    Not in this compact size.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (9 children)

    Try it on your desktop in the middle of a game and let me know how that goes.

    Oh, you mean application sleep/resume. Yeah, that's not standard. It's not hardware-based though. It just needs to offload the data in cache and RAM into storage, then put it back when it's needed. That's handled by software, and I would wager on it being available on SteamOS at large, and probably all of Linux, once it's published.

    It's not, it requires a special processor.

    I have not heard about it having a "special processor". It's a AMD Zen 4 CPU. It doesn't seem to have anything special there. Do you mean an additional processor? I haven't heard any discussion of that. They've said they want to add it to the Deck too, so I'm pretty sure you're incorrect.

    Uhhh it has EVERYTHING to do with the hardware?

    Their hardware isn't special. It's stuff you can buy off the shelf. Sure, choosing efficient hardware is important, but it isn't exclusive to the Steam Machine/Valve. That's what I was discussing. Anything extra they're getting out of it is software and/or firmware.

    Not in this compact size.

    First, yes, you can, if you make it yourself. Sure, it's hard, but not impossible.

    Second, the size has nothing to do with the efficiency! Sure, it's nice, but it doesn't reduce power draw. It's got the same amount of heat generation as any other computer with the same hardware. Yes, it has a fairly large radiator/heat-sink, but you can get the same size (or larger) yourself if you want.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (8 children)

    I have not heard about it having a "special processor". It's a AMD Zen 4 CPU.

    Look closelier. It's "semi-custom".

    It's stuff you can buy off the shelf.

    Which shelf is that?

    First, yes, you can, if you make it yourself.

    No.

    the size has nothing to do with the efficiency!

    It has everything to do with heat and noise.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago* (7 children)

    Look closelier. It's "semi-custom".

    They clarified, the silicon is off-the-shelf and the firmware is modified. It doesn't have some "special processor" or anything.

    It has everything to do with heat and noise.

    What? It being small only means the heat has less room to be removed, so it needs a higher power fan (or thermal throttling). It does have something to do with heat and noise, in that smaller is worse for them. If it's quite or cool, that's despite the size, not because of it.

    I don't care to argue about this, but you're making unfounded claims that this device is somehow special, because it's made by Valve I guess, and they need to be worshiped? It seems like a nice kit, but it isn't particularly groundbreaking. It's just a well designed and put together computer. Most of what it does is the same as any other computer, running Linux/Arch is capable of.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (6 children)

    the firmware is modified. It doesn't have some "special processor" or anything.

    The firmware is not part of the processor. Every processor has custom firmware.

    It being small only means the heat has less room to be removed

    Being custom allows it to be both small and quiet. Find me another PC in this size, with this much power, that's as quiet. You can't.

    because it's made by Valve I guess, and they need to be worshiped?

    I've already stated why several times. Now you're just being disingenuous.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    Being custom allows it to be both small and quiet. Find me another PC in this size, with this much power, that's as quiet. You can't.

    We don't know how quite this will be! Even the ones that were shown aren't necessarily final. Again, you're making claims without any evidence. I can't show you something as quite as small, because we don't know how quite it'll be. To show you it isn't anything crazy though, there are fanless PCs that you can get. As powerful? No. As quite? Even more. It's a trade off. It isn't magic. If you do something custom you could get even quieter with more power. Just connect a giant copper radiator to it without a fan.

    I see you didn't address the other points I made. Now we're down to just the one. Whatever. This one is pure speculation, so can't be disproven.

    Im not arguing this will be a bad device. I expect it to be fairly good for the price. It's just not really going to be something you can't get elsewhere without Valve, with the exception of Bluetooth resuming.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    We don't know how quite this will be!

    You can tell by looking at the design, and by who made it.

    there are fanless PCs that you can get. As powerful? No

    Please go back and read my first comment on this thread. I said quiet, powerful, and compact. All 3.

    I see you didn't address the other points I made

    I did. Several times.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    Alright, I'm done. By the "who made it" comment, I know there's no reasoning. There's nothing special about this device! The same amount of energy is used, which means heat, as any other device with the same hardware, and the hardware is just about off-the-shelf. Either the fans turn up, which means noise, or it thermal throttles. There's nothing here that could change the physics. Valve does not employ wizards.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (2 children)

    By the "who made it" comment, I know there's no reasoning

    LOL no you don't.

    The same amount of energy is used, which means heat, as any other device with the same hardware

    There is no other device with the same hardware. You know there isn't. I don't understand why you're making this up.

    There's nothing here that could change the physics. Valve does not employ wizards.

    No wizards required, just some smart engineers and novel design.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    There is no other device with the same hardware. You know there isn't. I don't understand why you're making this up.

    This again... Yes there are. Here's the specs: https://thegamepost.com/valve-steam-machine-full-specs/

    The "semi-custom" GPU they said is only firmware. The silicon is off-the-shelf. Everything else is also off-the-shelf. What don't you get about this? You can buy these parts yourself.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

    I know what the specs are. Here's what your link says:

    the Steam Machine runs on a custom AMD setup

    You seem intent on ignoring the package as a whole. Even if you could buy the CPU and the GPU, You cannot buy the motherboard or the case or the coolers or the power supply. If you buy comparable ones piecemeal, "off the shelf", it will be significantly larger and louder because the package is simply not optimized that way. What don't you get about this?

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    • [–] 40 points 1 year ago* (9 children)

    I've been running Bazzite on a Framework Desktop 64gb and it's a beast of a little machine.

    Honestly way more expensive than I would ever recommend for anyone who's using it solely for gaming. You could make something just as good, but bigger, for less. Or you could build something good enough and small for way less, depending on the performance you're trying to hit. But if you're in that sweet spot where you want a lot of power in a tiny package, it won't disappoint. You'd be hard pressed to find anything as close in performance and size for a lesser price.

    Plus side, you got a lot of vram if you wanna play with local LLMs.

    It's looking like the steam machine is gonna hit that sweet spot of being 'good enough' while being small and probably fairly priced.

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  • [–] 32 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    I think it’s good the machine is not super powered. If people stop buying the latest gpus so often, then devs will need to optimize their games or target weaker hardware.

    Some games have a steamdeck setting which I love.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    I think there's people who have gaming as a hobby, and people who have speccing and building a gaming PC as a hobby.

    And Valve was never going to sell anything to the PC Hobby crowd, because they get their fun from squeezing every dime and finding the absolute best bang for the buck or whatever.

    So I think it's sensible for Valve to be like "yeah, we're just going to make a pretty good machine for people who don't care about how much VRAM it has".

    And the comments of every review and YouTube video will be full of people complaining about how you can get so much more for so much less, and that it's dogshit, but that's because the people on those sites are the hobby people.

    But that won't necessarily translate into selling like hotcakes. I hope it does, for several reasons, but only time will tell if there's enough people in the market for that kind of machine that aren't the hobby people.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (3 children)

    A guy at work bought a 5080 and he plays FPSs. lol

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    Framework Desktop 64gb

    I wonder how that compares to my mini-ITX Ryzen 5700x3D/9070XT/64GB system. I guess yours is even smaller and better at running LLMs due to the unified memory, but mine is probably cheaper and better at gaming.

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    • [–] 20 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    It sounds like he just needs one of these

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago

    For anyone looking at these. Be a bit careful with getting one that is poor quality. I had one and there was sometimes lag and you would end up double pressing keys and stuff.

    It was a completely different model than the one in the picture. But I wanted to leave this warning so you read reviews first.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I have one almost identical to this for my bazzite machine and it works great

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago*

    Bought one when I got my raspberry pi, granted not nearly as fancy as the one in the original comment, thought I would use it all the time, then I learned about SSH.

    Poor thing just collects dust as the battery slowly dies peacefully.

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    [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Hey me too, but mine has an intel arc gpu on bazzite

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    [–] 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    There is a Framework-specific Bazzite image so I'm not sure why they were using the same one that goes on Steam Deck...

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