I saw this post titled "Scratch a anti-harm reductionist and a fascist bleeds" (https://lemmy.world/post/33320759)

I commented that "harm reduction" apparently means sending billions in weapons to israel while they commit genocide and shutting down campus protests speaking out against that genocide. I said that seemed pretty fascist to me.

Within an instant, they downvoted my post and banned me. Guess it's my fault for posting in a circlejerk community, but I'm still scratching my head on how that makes me a tankie. Something tells me this mod would be calling in the tanks to suppress any dissent if they could.

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[–] 59 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Lemmy comment: '"Harm reduction" apparently includes selling billions in weapons to israel while they carry out genocide and shutting down campus protests speaking out against that genocide. Seems pretty fascist to me.'

PTB, I don't see the tankie connections either.

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  • [–] [S] 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Thank you for obtaining my comment! I couldn't find it in the modlog and didn't know how else to get it, so I had to recall what I wrote from memory.

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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    They probably banned you with content removal, that doesn't generate modlog entries (Lemmy 0.19 anyway, 1.0 will generate these)

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  • [–] 39 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    PTB. That's a pretty standard leftist position, I don't see what's tankie about it.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    Associating anti-genocide with tankies is a tactic.
    The libs don't like to be called tankies so it's used to scare them off anti-genocide comments.
    Very similar of associating anti-genocide with antisemitism.
    Cheap hasbara tricks.

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  • [–] 41 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    PTB

    PugJesus should not be in charge of anything more than his own diaper.

    He accused me of being a "tankie" when I criticised Israeli propaganda lies.

    https://lemmy.world/post/33330562

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  • [–] 51 points 1 year ago (61 children)

    Looks like @PugJesus@lemmy.world has been going on a rampage against people who are critical of Israel lately, PTB for sure.

    @goat@sh.itjust.works Might want to kick this mod out of your community since he's poisoning it for others and kicking out people he shouldn't be.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (27 children)

    Idk, if he didn't kick our pj before why would goat do it now.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (26 children)

    Pug and I had a falling out, and he stepped down but retained his moderator role. If you check the modlog you can see he hasn't acted in quite a while until just recently

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (25 children)

    Why not remove him if he's causing more issues for you?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (24 children)
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (23 children)

    Having an unhinged narcissist as a mod is not ideal for any community.

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  • [–] -3 points 1 year ago (19 children)

    I agree, and I'm sure you're as critical of Davel as you are as Pug.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (18 children)

    No idea who Davel is but I have seen numerous bans by PugJesus recently for made up reasons. Usually "tankie" etiquette, by which he means anyone left of center, quite literally. Sometimes "sexual assault denier" by which he means people disagreeing with Israeli propaganda lies. To makes it worse he bans in unrelated communities because someone disagreed with him.

    He is not capable of being a moderator.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 year ago (17 children)

    Davel, who is an admin, does the exact same and is in this very thread.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (14 children)

    I can't comment since I haven't seen any bans by him. Not sure how it is relevant here either.

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  • [–] -3 points 1 year ago (13 children)
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago* (12 children)

    Ok, clearly not acceptable. But I still don't see much relevance to this thread?

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  • [–] -4 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    I'm just making sure you agree that Davels isn't an ideal moderator too

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (10 children)

    I glanced over and I am finding his views much more concerning.

    Still that is really not relevant. I am sure there is plenty of crap moderators out there. I am finding PugJesus particularly bad after revenge ban in unrelated community after an argument in completly different community. He should be removed straight away after that.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    I've since removed him, yeah.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    Thanks, I believe it was the right decision. Funnily enough, I don't have many issues with PugJesus views at all. It is his moderation which is a problem.

    Pretty much opposite to the other example you gave where I have major issues with this person views. His moderation merely follows this ideological pattern, that's all.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Davels does the exact same thing, but much worse

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (6 children)

    Admittedly, I haven't read all thread you linked but I haven't noticed anything personal in his bans. He seems to follow his ideological line.

    Now, I strongly disagree with his excuses for Russian aggression, denial of attempted genocide of Ukrainians, attempt to whitewash Tienanmen massacre etc. But when he bans/deletes/etc it looks like he does it because he is trying to hide facts inconvenient to the regimes he supports. Not because someone argued with him in a different thread about something completely unrelated.

    In another words, his moderation is completely unsurprising for his dictatorship-supporting instance and a reason I tend to not wander into tankie part of Lemmyverse.

    It appears to be a completely different issue to PugJesus.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    But how else could Goat deflect blame?

    Pug is his friend. They must use Whataboutism to deflect blame!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    Pug's not my friend, you nincompoop. Nor am I deflecting blame.

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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    Yeah it's not a good look that Tankie now means "I don't like genocide". Just further dissolves the word's meaning and enables .ml and hexbear to do more things.

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    Yeah it’s not a good look that Tankie now means “I don’t like genocide”.

    It's what it's meant on lemmy, particularly .world, for a while now. centrists just use it like (other) republicans use "woke."

    It means "this person has an opinion I know I'm morally wrong about. I don't want to change my position but I also don't want to look bad, so I'll pick a term I can't define and use it as a cudgel against them."

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (5 children)
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Well when people get banned for being anti-genocide and war as "Tankie" what does it mean?

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (17 children)

    I'll investigate later, thanks for the ping. I've since unbanned some of the users, such as @hark@lemmy.world, the others I'm still investigating and some are also spam

    I'm fine with people sharing different views, even if they're controversial. Tankies are also allowed to comment in the community, as long as everyone follows the rules and is mutually respectful towards each other, feel free to engage.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    Wasn't gonna bother until after I saw this, but looks like PJ gave me a ban for clarifying UN reporting on sexual assault.

    Didn't think I was posting anything spicy but you never know the crowd.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    That sounds like .word mods, banning people for proving them wrong.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Yea, seems likely

    That bucket guy said 'rape of Jews on October 7th was widespread', and the 'widespread' part fucking got to me.

    Not that it's a huge difference but I couldn't stand that guy running around citing that UN report that said it found 'reasonable grounds to believe sexual violence occurred', which is a fucking far cry from 'rape was widespread'

    But, if I were to be charitable, i could see a mod coming in cold to that conversation just assuming the worst. But im pretty sure it was pug, if the 'sort by mod' function is accurate.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    It most likely is, check this community. He's banned people for calling him out on unrelated communities .

    Pug is mentally unwell and lashes out at people wanting something better in the world.

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  • [–] -4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

    You were banned for using semantic arguments that rapes occurred.

    The UN is not a judicial body and cannot unilaterally define criminal offences within sovereign states. The UN can, however, assist and fund independent bodies to investigate, which found reasonable grounds that Hamas raped women during the 7th of October massacres.

    You can even watch some footage, testimonies of victims and witnesses, first-responder testimonies, and captured terrorist testimonies about these rapes.

    So arguing that the UN wasn't verbatim with what the user, @PhilipTheBucket@quokk.au, said is a bad-faith position to take, it's handwaving away that the rapes occurred and implying that the UN is a judicial body.

    Basing the entirety of your argument on 'Well, not ALL of them were raped' is a pretty disgusting stance that handwaves atrocities, which is in violation of the Apologia and Revisionism rule. Your ban was made permanent, and you weren't warned beforehand, which I'm not happy with, so I can unban you within 24 hours if you so desire and if you follow the rules in the future.

    I'm also not interested in arguing about the validity of the rapes either because it's not relevant to the thread at hand.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I was addressing someone saying that 'rapes of jewish women were widespread', which to my ears is an unfounded characterization of a report which went to great lengths not to say anything half as definitive. If anyone in that thread was guilty of apologia or revisionism, it sure as fuck wasn't me.

    But you're right, this isn't the place to argue about it. Do what you want.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    @hark@lemmy.world , could you maybe add a "ban reserved" or something in the title?

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  • [–] 33 points 1 year ago* (7 children)

    Are you a "tankie"? Or is that mod just such a turbolib that they think you must be a tankie if you're farther left than blue maga?

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  • [–] [S] 21 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    The mod never elaborated, but based on their behavior, I assume the latter.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    How can the mod be a turbolib when he claims to be “vaguely leftist”? /s

    Maybe he’s simply lying, but I suspect it’s that he’s oblivious to or suppressing his own unexamined political positions.

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  • [–] 38 points 1 year ago

    looks at the op of the post you commented on

    Yep, Power tripping Bastard alright. Any criticism of Israeli genocide and the politicians he supports that fund it "Tankie behavior".

    Even though most liberals in America are against it.

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  • [–] 35 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (16 children)

    PTB.

    Setting aside the question of your true ideology, I don’t think people should be banned for their ideology. Bans should be based on behavior.

    Ironically I hate tankies as much as anyone and I’m having a big fight with one right now but I still think they should be allowed to participate on the same footing as everyone as long as they follow the rules.

    Edit: after reading further this is even worse because the rules are actually pretty much in line with my position. Tankies are explicitly allowed to participate as long as they follow the rules. So this isn’t even supported by anything other than impotent mod rage.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    Ideology to some extent is behavior, or at least helps determine behavior, when people act in a manner consistent with their own ideological positions. I can see an appeal to "allow all ideas as long as they don't make trouble", but when the nature of most ideologies is to include something along the lines of "it is a morally good thing to spread this ideology to other people" to a lesser or greater extent, and some ideologies require harmful behavior for one to act consistently with it, the conclusion that seems obvious to me is that believing in certain ideologies is itself bad enough behavior for it to be justifiable to exclude those people from a given online community, because such a person will either cause trouble or be a hypocrite. And after all, ideology isn't some immutable inherit trait, a person can change one's ideology and people often do.

    All that being said, that particular statement isn't really a clear statement of ideology at all. I disagree with it's implication, but all it really does is demonstrate either a misunderstanding of what harm reduction means, or a viewpoint that is too black-and-white to allow for it, which can be a feature of too many ideological positions to narrow it down.

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  • [+] -6 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    And that’s how you end up with a Nazi bar.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Yeah I’ve heard the proverb but I think it’s not that hard to set behavior based rules that exclude Nazis.

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  • [+] -17 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Of course not, but what about the other Nazi-adjacent pieces of shit like Tankies?

    Sadly some fash boot lickers are fine with a Tankie-Bar.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Yeah, I absolutely agree with you. !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works allows Tankies to comment and engage, some of them do, but only if they follow the rules.

    Most of the time they don't bother with the community though because their views and extremism don't hold up to scrutiny.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    Most of the time they don’t bother with the community though because their views and extremism don’t hold up to scrutiny.

    I'm sure it's not because of the mods' behavior.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    The modlog is open, and the majority of bans are temporary, you can verify it yourself

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    I've interacted with your fellow mod plenty in the past to know everything he's about.

    He shrieks "tankie" at everyone who disagrees with him, particularly at anyone who disagrees with his support for netanyahu's genocide. And you made sure he got to keep his banhammer to use as a disagree button.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    And I've since reversed those bans and reminded him of the rules. if you have something with him, take it up with him.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    And I’ve since reversed those bans and reminded him of the rules.

    He's not going to stop banning people for disliking genocide.

    if you have something with him, take it up with him.

    I have. Got me banned from most of startrek.website. He got super pissed off when I said that centrists hate communists so much because they're still salty about the fall of berlin.

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago

    I always suspected this guy was continuously posting historical memes and artifacts to, at times, post his own revisionist agenda. No wonder he's a power tripping mod too.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    How can someone that likes Snatcher be bad?

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