The freeer the market, the freeeeeeeer the people 🤣
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rooted in a well-documented pattern of unfair trade, subsidies, intellectual property theft and surveillance.
Why are they describing the US auto industry?
Congress needs to make a law/bill instead to require stringent checks that verify zero remote telemetry, crash testing/safety scores and equipment, fuel efficiency requirements, lighting/functionality requirements, etc.
Then if the Chinese ones pass, cool. If they don't then the "ban" is in place like they wanted.
My guess is they won't because the "big three domestic" manufacturers won't pass either.
Maybe if the US auto industry spent the last 10-15 years innovating and reinvesting instead of paying dividends and stock buybacks, it'd not be dying on its arse right now.
Made their own bed, and expecting the US consumer to keep buying overpriced swill.
So car manufacturers want to block their competition?
I am shocked I tell you, shocked!
Or you know, the government could just match Chinese industry subsidies so they're competing on level playing fields.
China's government is using government power to invest in critical and necessary industries that benefits everyone, like renewables and EVs, driving down their costs.
The US instead spends it's money investing in fossil fuel companies, and letting billionaires hoard it, and then complains when Chinese EVs are cheaper. You're the richest fucking country in the world. Stop fucking whining and start using your wealth to produce competitive EVs. It's not that fucking complicated.
You forgot to mention investing in the MIC (Military Industrial Compex).
I would argue everything they do for oil and anti-electric legislation is US car subsidies.
They would have to go back in time and apply those subsidies 15 years ago. Chinese are so far ahead at this point, US stands little chance of catching up. Couldn't hurt though.
The best time may have been yesterday, but the second best time is today.
So far ahead in what way? We're talking about powering electric motors not building pico-scale computer processors. The difficult advancements in EVs is with the battery technology and battery technology is not specific to EVs themselves. We've been building cars for over a hundred years at this point so the rest of the car building process is already well established here.
Just like every other manufacturing industry where China has come to dominate, a big part of their strength is also developing the supply chain, suppliers and to foster competition. There’s an entire web of industry to support car building and scaling demand to make it work.
The money would be used for huge bonuses for the executives and US cars wouldn't be any cheaper or able to complete in the end.
Or you know, the government could just match Chinese industry subsidies
The problem is we did. The last 2-3 decades had billions in subsidies toward battery technology and battery electric vehicles. Then they got canceled. Then reinstated. Then canceled. At this point Chinas biggest advantage is being able to stay the course
Such a commitment to the Free Market.
You think that nationally subsidised and otherwise loss-making companies is the free market?
I appreciate capitalism isnt popular on lemmy but let's at least base the discourse in reality over propaganda.
The free market is about having little to no government control. Therefore any market that includes the Chinese market can not be described as a free market.
I would argue that banning Chinese companies would demonstrate more, not less, commitment to a free market.
Pretty much most if not all major US corps are being nationally subsidised.
From "bail outs" to tax breaks to grants where the company doesn't do what they are supposed to for said grant, but also don't have to pay it back.
It's just like how lobbying is just "legal" bribery.
It's all just bullshit.
nationally subsidized
Like when american auto manufacturers needed a bailout around 2011?
... Are you stupid? A free market allows for ANY competitors regardless of how the company is run or its location. By banning an entire countries products you are making the market less free for the buyer by lowering the competition for American cars.
And let's be honest US cars suck dick. I'm driving a fucking Dodge Laramie and its a piece of shit, the tech is all over the place with no normalized menus and and annoying as fuck central IPad for a dash.
Screw these guys. US automakers have basically abandoned any attempt to build an affordable, small, electric car leaving a giant gap for the Chinese to fill, and we would all be better off if they did.
I've owned a Chevy bolt for 4 years and love it, but Chevy/GM keeps trying to kill it (2nd cancellation in mid 2027) and move everybody to an electric Equinox. If they don't want to build small affordable (hopefully electric) cars, screw them, no sympathy. They clearly know people would buy these Chinese electrics.
The beatings won't stop until you buy an American car.
There's a commercial on the radio in GTA:VC. A baby is crying and the voiceover says, "This American baby is starving because you bought a cheaper, higher-quality Daihatsu!"
The US auto industry is so much more vast than US companies. We only have a few remaining ones, but everyone pretends like American brands are all that exist here in discussions like this.
rooted in a well-documented pattern of unfair trade, subsidies, intellectual property theft and surveillance
I have faith in America, there's no way we're losing to china in patterns of unfair trade, subsidies, IP theft and surveillance.
The CEO of Ford publicly keeping his Chinese car tells you everything you need to know. They’re afraid of the competition
People call for reasonable Healthcare and an end to fascism. Guess which of these calls is more likely to get answered.
Skim read that as 'cheese made cars'. That was a confusing couple of seconds.
lol how about y'all actually make competitive cars people want to buy first?
it's easier to bribe governments then it is to actually make something that isn't pure trash
But but but non-chinese automakers aren't evil like China is and surely they won't shove their vehicles full of spyware crap!
They are still evil but some are still better. Subaru has one of the better privacy policies, though still sucks. At least they don't sell your usage to insurance companies so far.
At least they don’t sell your usage to insurance companies so far.
What a grim sentence
That's the state of our privacy laws or the lack of them. The talks of telemetry in cars are starting to be discussed in politics though I have low expectations on any positive outcome lol
I mean look of course I don't trust China blindly to sell me an electric car that doesn't have some kind of privacy invading aspect to it.. that is why you have good cybersecurity regulations with agencies focused on maintaining a high level of standards in domestic markets... but I ALSO sure as hell don't trust US or "western" automakers to not do equally evil shit with privacy invading crap and unlike China.... there is much more of an economic incentive to invade my privacy by domestic interests.
I also for the record don't trust the US government or other "western" governments to properly penalize automakers for invading my privacy, to the point that even if it is "illegal" international corporations surely just see it as a minor cost of doing business.
so shrugs my opinion is do better "western" car companies
Yeah IMO if I had choice of US made car that sucks and has a ton of telemetry versus a Chinese car that is better but has telemetry and cheaper well why not get it and disable the telemetry lol.
Also there is a frustrating lack of nuance here, if you are a US senator or maybe like an Admiral in the US navy maybe you shouldn't drive a modern foreign car... whatever that means (which itself is a question that needs to be reflected on critically, does it matter where the car is made vs. what open and inspectable standards it is built to?) but if you are an average person a foreign government gains virtually nothing by obessively surveilling you, whereas corporations and entities within the domestic sphere of influence of your country ABSOLUTELY do gain from it.... they are gaining from it this very moment by surveilling all of us.
All this panic about Chinese electric cars is completely centered around the perspective of the first category of people... which isn't to say that this isn't bullshit anyways the computers that run internal combustion engine cars are MASSIVELY complicated with an absolutely UNFATHOMABLE amount of code, this idea that eletric cars are some "new" threat vector is insulting to the intelligence of human beings.
"Chinese-made". We had this exact conversation over 40 years ago. The result was Honda opening their factory in Marysville, OH. Under the laws at the time, cars manufactured at this factory were American-made, and not covered by any trade restrictions.
Now you might be thinking they'll use a different definition, like company ownership. Except Chinese companies already own minority stakes in several western brands. And since companies can own other companies, or stakes in other companies, it's trivial to setup a chain of shell companies. Chinese brands can own a company in Sweden that owns a stake in (e.g) GM.
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