▲ 381 ▼ AI coders think they’re 20% faster — but they’re actually 19% slower (pivot-to-ai.com) submitted 1 year ago by dgerard@awful.systems to c/techtakes@awful.systems 102 comments fedilink hide all child comments podcast version video version
[+] Photuris@lemmy.ml -8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (10 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 10 child comments replies: [–] EnsignWashout@startrek.website 20 points 1 year ago* (2 children) But when a mid-tier or entry level dev can do 60% of what a senior can do, it’ll be a great way to cut costs. Same as how an entry level architect can build a building 60% as tall, and that'll last 60% as long, right? Edit: And an entry level aerospace engineer with AI assistance will build a plane that's 60% as good at not crashing. I'm not looking forward to the world I believe is coming... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] mountainriver@awful.systems 8 points 1 year ago (1 child) Get 2 and the plane will be 120% as good! In fact if children with AI are a mere 1% as good, a school with 150 children can build 150% as good! I am sure this is how project management works, and if it is not maybe Elon can get Grok to claim that it is. (When not busy praising Hitler.) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] froztbyte@awful.systems 4 points 1 year ago this brooks no argument and it’s clear we should immediately throw all available resources at ai so as to get infinite improvement!!~ (I even heard some UN policy wonk spout the AGI line recently 🙄) permalink fedilink source parent [+] Feyd@programming.dev 19 points 1 year ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] diz@awful.systems 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) I think more low tier output would be a disaster. Even pre AI I had to deal with a project where they shoved testing and compliance at juniors for a long time. What a fucking mess it was. I had to go through every commit mentioning Coverity because they had a junior fixing coverity flagged "issues". I spent at least 2 days debugging a memory corruption crash caused by such "fix", and then I had to spend who knows how long reviewing every such "fix". And don't get me started on tests. 200+ tests, of them none caught several regressions in handling of parameters that are shown early in the frigging how-to. Not some obscure corner case, the stuff you immediately run into if you just follow the documentation. With AI all the numbers would be much larger - more commits "fixing coverity issues" (and worse yet fixing "issues" that LLM sees in code), more so called "tests" that don't actually flag any real regressions, etc. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Seminar2250@awful.systems 15 points 1 year ago* (2 children) half as good as expert human 60% of what a senior can do is there like a character sheet somewhere so i can know where i fall on this developer spectrum permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] V0ldek@awful.systems 10 points 1 year ago (1 child) It's going to be your INT bonus modifier, but you can get a feat that also adds the WIS modifier For prolonged coding sessions you do need CON saving throws, but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ledivin@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) I must have picked up a feat somewhere because I hit that shit way more than once per short rest permalink fedilink source parent [–] diz@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Yeah, the glorious future where every half-as-good-as-expert developer is now only 25% as good as an expert (a level of performance also known as being "completely shit at it"), but he's writing 10x the amount of unusable shitcode. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] Photuris@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zbyte64@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) Okay but that is different from the argument that entry developers only need to be half as good to deliver a working product permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies)
[–] EnsignWashout@startrek.website 20 points 1 year ago* (2 children) But when a mid-tier or entry level dev can do 60% of what a senior can do, it’ll be a great way to cut costs. Same as how an entry level architect can build a building 60% as tall, and that'll last 60% as long, right? Edit: And an entry level aerospace engineer with AI assistance will build a plane that's 60% as good at not crashing. I'm not looking forward to the world I believe is coming... permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] mountainriver@awful.systems 8 points 1 year ago (1 child) Get 2 and the plane will be 120% as good! In fact if children with AI are a mere 1% as good, a school with 150 children can build 150% as good! I am sure this is how project management works, and if it is not maybe Elon can get Grok to claim that it is. (When not busy praising Hitler.) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] froztbyte@awful.systems 4 points 1 year ago this brooks no argument and it’s clear we should immediately throw all available resources at ai so as to get infinite improvement!!~ (I even heard some UN policy wonk spout the AGI line recently 🙄) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mountainriver@awful.systems 8 points 1 year ago (1 child) Get 2 and the plane will be 120% as good! In fact if children with AI are a mere 1% as good, a school with 150 children can build 150% as good! I am sure this is how project management works, and if it is not maybe Elon can get Grok to claim that it is. (When not busy praising Hitler.) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] froztbyte@awful.systems 4 points 1 year ago this brooks no argument and it’s clear we should immediately throw all available resources at ai so as to get infinite improvement!!~ (I even heard some UN policy wonk spout the AGI line recently 🙄) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] froztbyte@awful.systems 4 points 1 year ago this brooks no argument and it’s clear we should immediately throw all available resources at ai so as to get infinite improvement!!~ (I even heard some UN policy wonk spout the AGI line recently 🙄) permalink fedilink source parent
[+] Feyd@programming.dev 19 points 1 year ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] diz@awful.systems 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) I think more low tier output would be a disaster. Even pre AI I had to deal with a project where they shoved testing and compliance at juniors for a long time. What a fucking mess it was. I had to go through every commit mentioning Coverity because they had a junior fixing coverity flagged "issues". I spent at least 2 days debugging a memory corruption crash caused by such "fix", and then I had to spend who knows how long reviewing every such "fix". And don't get me started on tests. 200+ tests, of them none caught several regressions in handling of parameters that are shown early in the frigging how-to. Not some obscure corner case, the stuff you immediately run into if you just follow the documentation. With AI all the numbers would be much larger - more commits "fixing coverity issues" (and worse yet fixing "issues" that LLM sees in code), more so called "tests" that don't actually flag any real regressions, etc. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] diz@awful.systems 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) I think more low tier output would be a disaster. Even pre AI I had to deal with a project where they shoved testing and compliance at juniors for a long time. What a fucking mess it was. I had to go through every commit mentioning Coverity because they had a junior fixing coverity flagged "issues". I spent at least 2 days debugging a memory corruption crash caused by such "fix", and then I had to spend who knows how long reviewing every such "fix". And don't get me started on tests. 200+ tests, of them none caught several regressions in handling of parameters that are shown early in the frigging how-to. Not some obscure corner case, the stuff you immediately run into if you just follow the documentation. With AI all the numbers would be much larger - more commits "fixing coverity issues" (and worse yet fixing "issues" that LLM sees in code), more so called "tests" that don't actually flag any real regressions, etc. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Seminar2250@awful.systems 15 points 1 year ago* (2 children) half as good as expert human 60% of what a senior can do is there like a character sheet somewhere so i can know where i fall on this developer spectrum permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] V0ldek@awful.systems 10 points 1 year ago (1 child) It's going to be your INT bonus modifier, but you can get a feat that also adds the WIS modifier For prolonged coding sessions you do need CON saving throws, but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ledivin@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) I must have picked up a feat somewhere because I hit that shit way more than once per short rest permalink fedilink source parent
[–] V0ldek@awful.systems 10 points 1 year ago (1 child) It's going to be your INT bonus modifier, but you can get a feat that also adds the WIS modifier For prolonged coding sessions you do need CON saving throws, but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Ledivin@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) I must have picked up a feat somewhere because I hit that shit way more than once per short rest permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Ledivin@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago but you can get advantage from drinking coffee (once per short rest) I must have picked up a feat somewhere because I hit that shit way more than once per short rest permalink fedilink source parent
[–] diz@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (1 child) Yeah, the glorious future where every half-as-good-as-expert developer is now only 25% as good as an expert (a level of performance also known as being "completely shit at it"), but he's writing 10x the amount of unusable shitcode. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] Photuris@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zbyte64@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) Okay but that is different from the argument that entry developers only need to be half as good to deliver a working product permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies)
[+] Photuris@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] zbyte64@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) Okay but that is different from the argument that entry developers only need to be half as good to deliver a working product permalink fedilink source parent
[–] zbyte64@awful.systems 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) Okay but that is different from the argument that entry developers only need to be half as good to deliver a working product permalink fedilink source parent