NGram comments on Dating has gotten so expensive that nearly half of U.S. singles say it's no longer worth it, as the average night out approaches $200

Dating has gotten so expensive that nearly half of U.S. singles say it's no longer worth it, as the average night out approaches $200 (fortune.com)

submitted 5 months ago by TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world to c/dating@lemmy.world

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[–] NGram@piefed.ca 18 points 5 months ago (14 children)

At the risk of this sounding a lot like victim blaming, why are people spending USD$200 on a first date!? The first date is to get to know them and shouldn't be expensive, especially if you're not even sure you're compatible yet. The paid experience isn't the point (except as far as it facilitates getting to know the other person).

There's some serious economic problems right now, but going out and being expected to spend a lot of money would be a serious sign of financial incompatibility for me.

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] -3 points 5 months ago* (13 children)

because that's what it costs for dinner for two at most basic bars and restaurants in a city.

a dinner date is the traditional date.

women, by and large, expect men to take them on traditional dates and pay for everything. even if you split costs, it's still expensive.

when i go out, by myself, to take myself out to dinner, a cheap dinner at a dive bar is $60. a nicer one, is double or triple that.

last time i spend less than $100 on dinner date was like a decade ago, back when things cost about half or less than they do now.

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[–] NGram@piefed.ca 6 points 5 months ago (12 children)

Maybe it's a cultural difference (I live in Canada), but I'd never take a woman out to a dinner date for the first date. And certainly not to a place that's $100 each. Going out for drinks (coffee/alcohol/mocktails/etc.) is my preferred option, especially for people I've met on dating apps. Or doing some sort of activity. It's chill and a much better atmosphere to get to know someone. And if you run out of things to talk about with the virtual stranger you can talk about the activity. Traditional expectations are never based on current reality, they are based on the past. If they're looking for a traditional relationship with traditional roles, that's a very good reason for me to avoid them. We don't live in the 18th century anymore.

I occasionally see people who say they expect that sort of thing as a first date and I simply find it unrealistic. More power to them if they can find someone who meets that expectation, but I don't think that's a modern expectation. Feminism is literally about equality (or close to it) and we've made a lot of progress towards it. I think most people want an equal partner, not a meal ticket.

Also US$60 for a cheap meal? Wow your economy is wild. I regularly go out to a pub downtown and get a meal and a beer for under CA$40. I often get take-out lunches (good soft drink & sandwich) for CA$20. Even going out to the most popular place on OpenTables in my city is less than CA$50 per person without drinks. I'd have no problem taking a date to any of those places and paying for it all as a third date, though I'd hope we'd be on the same page about splitting bills equitably by that point. (Note that the Canadian dollar is worth less than the USA dollar)

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[–] dkppunk@piefed.social 5 points 5 months ago (2 children)

It’s not a cultural thing, it’s a weird manosphere thing. If you read the guy’s comment history, it quickly becomes obvious why he is single and can’t keep a relationship. If you don’t feel like it, which I don’t blame you, I summarized it in a recent comment to him:

I’ve noticed your complaints up and down this thread, I’ve also noticed them around the threadiverse for a while and I am beginning to see a pattern. You tend to be aggressively argumentative, denigrate women as a whole/complain about “woke”, refuse to see things from other people’s perspectives, and don’t listen to anyone’s advice. Have you ever heard the phrase “if everyone around you is an asshole, then maybe you’re the asshole”? Perhaps part of the issue is your behavior and attitude.

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[–] NGram@piefed.ca 4 points 5 months ago (1 child)

I know, I was getting a similar vibe. I just wasn't going to call it out because then he'd be less likely to engage since everyone (else) knows the stigma against the manosphere cult(ure). I thought it'd be more effective to address his arguments than to attack the community he is strongly connected to.

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[–] dkppunk@piefed.social 3 points 5 months ago

I commend you for your patience because you have far more than me.

I’ve seen him around for a while and he’s always making the same comments about women. That guy is only going to change when he truly wants to, which does not look likely at this time. Good luck if you decide keep trying.

Hope you have a great day :)

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[+] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] -6 points 5 months ago* (8 children)

If you lived where I live, you'd get no dates. The women decide the parameters of the dates they will accept, not the men.

They have no trouble repeatedly finding men who will take them on expensive first dates, because there are many men who are willing to pay $200 for the privilege of talking with a woman for an hour or two. So that is the standard they expect. Any man who doesn't offer that is devaluing them as people, in their eyes.

It's basic economics. Dating is a highly economic activity. money plays a huge role in mating. her time is worth money, if she is givng you her time, you better be offering her money or something money can buy.

it's unrealistic to you, yes. But it's not to them. many women where i live, would rather be alone, than date or marry a man who isn't boosting their lifestyle, as in, if she makes 150K/yr she ONLY wants men who make 300K/yr because a man who makes 200K or less can't 'add value' to her life, as in raise her social and economic standing.

and dating has ALWAYS been about this. traditional gender roles still dominate heterosexual dating, as much as people like to claim and believe they do not. people love to talk about love, but the funny thing is love tends to go away when the money does...

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[–] DireTech@sh.itjust.works 2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Are you in the Bay Area where there are both more men and high paychecks? Because I’ve been all over the US and that’s the only place where I could somewhat believe this is the norm.

Meet up for coffee or a drink. If there’s interest, you can maybe extend it but this way it’s lower pressure and cheaper if there’s no interest. Nothing worse than getting yourself into something longer when you can tell in the first few minutes you aren’t interested.

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] 0 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Yeah, I am in Boston, it's as expensive as the bay area.

Coffee is only available during the day. Drinks are expensive.

If you hit it off, you have to keep seeing them and going on more dates... dinner dates cost $200. that's just how life is.

You can't have a romantic relationship based on getting coffee at noon on saturdays.

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[–] DireTech@sh.itjust.works 3 points 5 months ago (1 child)

Depends on who you’re interested in. I’m frugal and had no interest dating someone who wanted to blow hundreds going out every weekend. Is it happening because they’re demanding it or because you assume you need to do it?

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] -1 points 5 months ago*

cool. I have never met anyone 'frugal' in my dating pool over a decade.

I've met people who seem frugal at first, but then start demanding very expensive 'favors' from you though!

I met one lady where we had nice low cost dates, but then she asked me to pay her $5000 car repair bill.

It's how dating is. If you want to date, you have to pay. There is no getting around it.

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[–] NGram@piefed.ca 2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

If you lived where I live, you’d get no dates. The women decide the parameters of the dates they will accept, not the men.

If I get no dates because of parameters that I've chosen, I'm pretty sure I decided just as much as the women. On the other hand, I've never had a woman turn down a date with me. Not that I put much effort into getting dates or even swiping on online dating apps...

I'd also rather be alone than be in a relationship with someone who doesn't add to my life. That is not exclusive to women. The only people who don't share that opinion are the people with no sense of self-worth. The USA might be culturally obsessed with money (more than the rest of the world), but there are things worth more in life than having a large bank account. I think you'll find that your economic lens on dating is not giving the whole picture and that you're devaluing your own worth. The women who do want men who make way more than them are hypercapitalists and the state of the world right now is exactly why they're not worth caring about.

and dating has ALWAYS been about this. traditional gender roles still dominate heterosexual dating, as much as people like to claim and believe they do not. people love to talk about love, but the funny thing is love tends to go away when the money does…

Maybe in the USA, but certainly not in the world as a whole. I don't know of any of my friends or family in relationships right now where only the woman cooks and cleans and the man pays for everything. Everyone splits chores, work their jobs, and take each other out on dates. Not that I'm a fan of marriage, but it's not love if a little of the worse of "for better or for worse" (financial hardship) is all it takes to break it. But if the primary reason to be together is financial, as you suggest, then that would explain a lot as to why those relationships would fail. Better to just avoid anyone who might be put off by a bit of financial turmoil instead of wasting time with them.

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] 0 points 5 months ago (2 children)

i mean, yeah, you're welcome not to date. that's fine. a lot of people are checking out because it's a losing game.

I am not checking out because I want a family and I can't make one on my own. So i have to date and hope I find someone who also wants a family.

Not many women want families anymore either. They just want to party and travel their entire life.

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[–] NGram@piefed.ca 3 points 5 months ago (1 child)

I don't think you realize that every reply you've made to me makes it sounds like you've already checked out of dating. You're only interested in the women who don't want you. You're calling it a losing game. You're blaming women for not meeting requirements that only you can set or change. Those all sound like rationalisations to why you're not successful in dating instead of trying a different approach or doing a bit of introspection into why what you're doing isn't working for you. Sure, on paper you're still in the game but you've made it so hard for yourself to find someone that you're effectively not even playing.

Also dating isn't a game you can win or lose. Being alone isn't a loss. Having a partner isn't a win. It's about enjoying life however you live it.

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[–] TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world [S] 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I'm 40 dude. Yeah, there aren't many choices, and most of them are terrible choices.

But you make the best with what life offers you. And yes, life is a game you win or lose. You get the things you want, or you don't. Typically, people don't enjoy life if they don't get the things they want, and they do, if they do, and their enjoyment is directly a product of if they have obtained the things they believe they should have.

I am not blaming women for anything. I am actively dating in the trenches and I'm telling people what I see and experience. You may find that very upsetting and offensive, or feel the need to 'correct' me by lecturing me on my experiences being false or wrong, that's great for you. But it won't change anything about my life experiences or my dating experiences. You are a random stranger shouting at a random stranger how 'wrong' they are... because they are talking about things you don't like to hear or don't agree with or don't believe are real.

I am not interested in most women I meet, to be fair. Because they aren't offering anything I find desirable, but in order to determine that, I must actually socialize with them. I don't pretend I know anything about them until I have met them in person. There is always the possibility that I run into someone who is what I'm looking for, it has happened in the past! But alas, I lack the psychic abilities to know other people's preferences and desires before they have verbalized them to me.

Lecture me all you want if it makes you feel better? Dating systematically is getting difficult for everyone across multiple cultures. You can tell me that this is wrong or stupid or misogyny, but it won't change the facts on the ground being reported by the news, my sociologists, and by statistics.

Anymore than I personally, can make Donald Trump not president.

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