HasturInYellow comments on American Idiot gets pissed

What else would you call masked and unidentified officers abducting people with no warrant and sending them to concentration camps? I'm no historical scholar, but that seems an awful lot like gestapo to my eye.

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[+] Cptn_Slow@lemmy.world -20 points 1 year ago (4 children)

How are you supposed to get a warrant for a person you can't even prove is who they say they are?

And I'm pretty sure the gestapo had uniforms.

Further, if someone is actively avoiding law enforcement, wouldn't you think it would make sense to not look like law enforcement?

Also, where are you supposed to send a criminal that is awaiting deportation?

I understand it doesn't feel good, but I know plenty of people that followed the process, and obtained citizenship legally, and you are all saying "fuck that, let's have criminals do whatever they want" because it doesn't feel good.

By your logic, you would speed down the road in your car, and when you got caught, it's not fair because the cop was in an unmarked car, and wasn't specifically looking for you.

Or just maybe you made the choice to speed, so you have to pay the consequences if you get caught?

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[–] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

How are you supposed to get a warrant for a person you can't even prove is who they say they are?

The usual way. It's not hard.

Further, if someone is actively avoiding law enforcement, wouldn't you think it would make sense to not look like law enforcement?

Yes, much better to just look like anonymous armed kidnappers. The downside is that actual anonymous armed kidnappers can pretend to be undercover ICE agents, which has already happened multiple times.

Also, where are you supposed to send a criminal that is awaiting deportation?

A regular jail, where they have access to a lawyer and the other protections of due process enshrined in our most fundamental laws.

I understand it doesn't feel good, but I know plenty of people that followed the process, and obtained citizenship legally, and you are all saying "fuck that, let's have criminals do whatever they want" because it doesn't feel good.

That might have a shred of validity if they weren't also kidnapping people who were following the legal process and attending their immigration hearings. Not to mention kidnapping actual citizens. And you all are saying "Fuck that, if your skin is brown you're going down."

No one is saying for criminals to do whatever they want. We just want you lot to acknowledge that the law of the land ensures due process to everyone, not just citizens.

By your logic, you would speed down the road in your car, and when you got caught, it's not fair because the cop was in an unmarked car, and wasn't specifically looking for you.

These people aren't being arrested mid-crime, they're kidnapping them from their homes, off the street, at their jobs, and again, at their legal immigration hearings. And there are multiple accounts of mistaken identity, or no specific target at all. Your analogy isn't applicable.

It's much more like a man in street clothes and an unmarked car who refuses to identify themselves, kidnapping me at gunpoint as I get into my car because it's a yellow sports car and yellow sports cars are statistically more likely to speed. Yeah, that's not fair.

Or just maybe you made the choice to speed, so you have to pay the consequences if you get caught?

And when you make the choice of wiping your ass with the 14th amendment, you have to pay the consequence of real patriots calling you a fascist bootlicker.

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[+] Cptn_Slow@lemmy.world -14 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The usual way. It's not hard.

Oh do explain, since it's so easy.

A regular jail, where they have access to a lawyer and the other protections of due process enshrined in our most fundamental laws.

But I thought America's prison system was broken too?

No one is saying for criminals to do whatever they want. We just want you lot to acknowledge that the law of the land ensures due process to everyone, not just citizens.

Finally you say something we can all agree upon.

Your analogy isn't applicable.

Because you don't want it to be... Sure it isn't applicable to every single situation, but I'd be willing to guess it applies to a majority.

These people aren't being arrested mid-crime, they're kidnapping them from their homes, off the street, at their jobs, and again, at their legal immigration hearings.

Isn't being in a country when you're not supposed to be "mid-crime"?

And as much as you clearly want it to be "kidnapping", it's not. It's called "unlawful arrest" or "wrongful arrest", and a quick Google search shows these people are about to get a large settlement.

Again, it's not perfect, but nothing is. All I can hope is that the actual victims are compensated handsomely.

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[–] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Oh do explain, since it's so easy.

I'm not going to explain the intricacies of the criminal justice system to someone who clearly doesn't understand the most basic concept of due process. It's also irrelevant; you don't get to ignore the Constitution because respecting people's inalienable rights is inconvenient.

But I thought America's prison system was broken too?

It certainly is, but that's a separate issue. Also, how much of a psychopath do you have to be to say "The prison system has flaws, therefore we should just abandon it and throw people in internment camps". That's fascist talk.

Finally you say something we can all agree upon.

Clearly not since you're proudly advocating against due process as guaranteed by the Constitution.

Your analogy isn't applicable.

Because you don't want it to be... Sure it isn't applicable to every single situation, but I'd be willing to guess it applies to a majority.

What I want has nothing to do with it, it's inapplicable by the facts of the situation. It would be applicable to uniformed border patrol agents catching migrants in the process of crossing the border, or a uniformed police officer arresting an illegal migrant in the process some other crime. But these officers are not uniformed, and the fact that multiple legal migrants and US citizens have been rounded up proves that they don't even have probable cause.

Isn't being in a country when you're not supposed to be "mid-crime"?

No. Entering the country illegally is a crime, residing in it afterwards is a civil offense.

Again, it's not perfect, but nothing is. All I can hope is that the actual victims are compensated handsomely.

Nothing is perfect, but this isn't even good. It's flagrant disregard for the Constitution. Again, you don't get to discard the Constitution because it makes your job harder.

No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

The Constitution is very clear. Doesn't matter how they got here, every person in the jurisdiction of American law is guaranteed due process.

Maybe you should read the news, and stop getting all your information from your WASP neighbors in Bumblefuck, USA.

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[–] waterSticksToMyBalls@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

At least your username is accurate

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