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[–] 45 points 8 months ago (42 children)

Veganism is unnatural because we're all omnivores, and evolved eating both plants and animals.

Impregnating cows this way is also unnatural.

Both can be true.

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  • [–] 78 points 8 months ago (5 children)

    Fun fact, we evolved to eat raw meat, that's why we have an appendix. Then, when we stopped eating raw meat, we started to evolve away from the appendix.

    Evolutionary arguments don't support the naturalist fallacy, because evolution doesn't work like that. It responds to environmental pressures. It's not some guiding light for what we're "meant" to be doing, it's the tools we've got to support what we already did.

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  • [–] 17 points 8 months ago

    This article says it was for raw vegetables:

    For our ancestors, the appendix most likely evolved to help them digest a diet rich in raw vegetables and cellulose, as it still does in many herbivorous mammals. Thousands of years ago it would have functioned as an extension of the cecum, involved in the bacterial digestion of fibrous plant materials.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (2 children)

    To quote Meatloaf: 🎵🎶 IIIIIIIIIIII WANT MY MONEY APPENDIX BACK!🎶🎵

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  • [+] 9 points 8 months ago* (10 children)
  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago (2 children)

    Today, most people are "more vegan" than meat eater, too, as in they eat more grains and vegetables than meat. If that's what you meant.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (1 child)

    There's no evidence to support that. Best evidence is that our ancestors for the longest time were likely opportunistic omnivores. Plants of course were a large part of the diet, but looking back to about 3.9 mya meat was on the menu.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australopithecus_afarensis

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  • [+] 5 points 8 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago

    Yes scavenging for meat is generally considered a very important part of human evolution. Our stomachs are particularly acidic when compared to other great apes. This is believed to have evolved due to a high consumption of scavenged meats.

    You are right though plants generally did form a large portion of our and our ancestors diets.

    Important to note that as our brain size increased it did correlate with increased meat consumption as well. This all goes into calorie densities, available nutrients, and evolutionary pressures.

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  • [+] -7 points 8 months ago (5 children)
  • [+] 2 points 8 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (1 child)

    "outside insects and scavenging"

    So, scavenger and omnivore... never vegan

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  • [+] -5 points 8 months ago (2 children)
  • [+] 0 points 8 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

    We, humans, have only existed for around 200,000 years, you are referring to multiple different species that are explicitly not Homo Sapiens Sapiens that all had different organic needs and requirements than what we require. This stance really does not hold any kind of scientific relevance to the human diet. We are inarguably evolved, as humans, to be omnivores, and arguably obligate omnivores if you’re trying to be scientific about it.

    Veganism is a choice based on modern subjective morality, there is no objective or scientific explanation or reason for humans to be vegan. It’s a choice, plain and simple, and it does not make you better or worse than anyone else.

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  • [–] -2 points 8 months ago (7 children)

    Vegans will NEVER have the political clout to force their way of life on everyone, and they're mad AF about it.

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  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago

    Vegans don't want to force anything on anyone. What we want to do is to persuade people to change their minds. I believe wholeheartedly that veganism as a majority position is inevitable. In the past, the idea that black women would be allowed to vote was more unthinkable than majority veganism is now. History trends towards progressivism.

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  • [+] -7 points 8 months ago* (14 children)

    Not only that, but also vegan diet is literally making people crazy (or crazy people are more often on vegan diet, dealer's choice).

    Source: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/10408398.2020.1741505#abstract

    The majority of studies, and especially the higher quality studies, showed that those who avoided meat consumption had significantly higher rates or risk of depression, anxiety, and/or self-harm behaviors. There was mixed evidence for temporal relations, but study designs and a lack of rigor precluded inferences of causal relations. Our study does not support meat avoidance as a strategy to benefit psychological health.

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  • [–] 10 points 8 months ago (2 children)

    This study was funded in part via an unrestricted research grant from the Beef Checkoff, through the National Cattlemen's Beef Association.

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  • [–] 0 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    This is a metastudy not an original study though?

    (And this is a shitpost community)

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  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago

    It means this metastudy is less of a study and more of an advertisement. The outcome of a metastudy depends even more on who does it, especially if they make up the criteria for which research is "good" enough to include.

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  • [–] 8 points 8 months ago

    I think people on the left as whole would be more prone to depression and anxiety too. People who care about the world are generally more concious, more self-aware and critical, which turn into more worrying and at the extreme, anxiety.

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  • [–] 4 points 8 months ago* (5 children)

    I mean, the part you cited already mentioned it but later in the study it's stated even more clearly:

    Across all studies, there was no evidence to support a causal relation between the consumption or avoidance of meat and any psychological outcomes.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (4 children)

    A sentence later it says

    These authors posited that mental disorders may lead to the adoption of a meat-less diet. The authors stated that individuals with mental disorders may “choose a vegetarian diet as a form of safety or self-protective behavior”

    And I wrote

    or crazy people are more often on vegan diet, dealer’s choice

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  • [–] 5 points 8 months ago (3 children)

    You wrote

    vegan diet is literally making people crazy

    You were wrong about that, just walk it back dude, it's not a big deal, it's okay to be wrong about things.

    Also, people with anxiety and depression aren't widely considered to be "crazy".

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (2 children)

    Reading comprehension my dude. I wrote A or B, study says A or B.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (1 child)

    I am honestly and genuinely trying to help you out here. I used to struggle to accept when I was wrong about something because it made me feel stupid, but in reality, people actually respect you a lot more when you demonstrate that you can admit when you're wrong about things.

    You don't need to concede the whole argument, just a simple "oh yeah, you're right, the first part was definitely wrong, but I stand by the second part" would be a solid step in the right direction.

    Anyways, feel free to take my advice or not, I don't really care about the thing you're arguing about, I just saw someone who I thought I could maybe help avoid some of the problems I had in life.

    All the best!

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (3 children)

    vegan diet is literally making people crazy

    Wrong.

    (or crazy people are more often on vegan diet, dealer’s choice).

    Mmm, no, there is a right answer and it's this one. Well, it's this one with more inclusive language. Like "People who have experienced more hardship with psychological consequences are more likely to avoid consumption of animal products".

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