Dbzero Governance Vote Post https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/63525728

Ahoy mateys!

A few of our users have recently pointed out that a lot of the pro-Zionist accounts on the fediverse nowadays seem to come from the feddit.org instance.

But whatever the excuse happens to be, they need to do better imo. Israel is currently the most violent, fascist and genocidal nation state in the Middle East (if you exclude the US military bases there). And yet feddit.org seems to regard the Palestinians fighting against Israel’s ongoing illegal occupation of their land as the real terrorists. ....

More context

Our instance already voted to ban pro-Zionist accounts (see https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/60585441 for reference) and the rule that was implemented is here: Golden Rule #8.

As further context, you can find relevant comments and discussion in this post by a banned feddit admin in MoG (that fact they chose to post in MoG is in itself quite telling), and this post about their defederation from quokk.au over anti-semitism allegations has recently become active again. ...

Note 2: If you think feddit.org deserves a full instance ban instead, or have alternative suggestions, then please leave your comments below. If enough people think that’s the better option, then we’ll do that instead.

In the end the Post had around 70% of support by dbzer0 users, who in the comments also called for defederation.

Here is a Link to Dbzer0 instances tab https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/instances where if you go to blocked instances you can see fedddit.org is now defederated

i dont think feddit has made a post now, but when they do i will add it

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[+] 14 points 8 months ago (47 children)
  • [–] 18 points 8 months ago (6 children)

    You know you can just have multiple accounts on multiple instances, right? That gets you just about as full a view on the Fediverse as you might want. Heck, the only reason I'm not doing it is because I'm lazy.

    Also, whining about db0 then moving to the instance that literally implements CCP politics and shadow profiling and comes from a dev known to have had a chip against heteronormativity and weirdness (if not against neurodivergence) is... not the win you think it is.

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  • [–] 8 points 8 months ago

    Yup that's the way to go. Actually my first client I used for Lemmy (Liftoff) made multiple accounts really easy since you could switch feeds and accounts in one click and quickly. But even if you just use multiple accounts on the web switching between tabs or using Tesseract isn't that difficult.

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  • [+] -3 points 8 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago

    It's been on the public fediverse eye enough that I don't need to do your homework for you, but just look for mentions to piefed in this same sub. One of the exemplary things that was found was that you can't eg.: "upload a picture that contains the word 'anonymous'" and that Piefed lies to you about why.

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago

    Counterpoints:

    If you want to know a bit more about Rimu, the main Piefed dev, he made an interview a couple of months ago: https://tubefree.org/w/jLPZXv1Jynv7LRcuoteARf

    He's usually quite nice and helpful. That's not always the case with people who try to spread disinformation about Piefed.

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  • [+] 12 points 8 months ago (5 children)
  • [+] 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (5 children)
  • [–] 5 points 8 months ago (2 children)

    I can’t change anything about what is happening there, it’s not in my power to do so.

    Are you boycotting Israeli goods, media, and anything else that could give money to the Zionist entity? That's the bare minimum any person of conscience should do.

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  • [+] 1 point 8 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago* (1 child)

    I can’t care about everything to the fullest degree or be informed about everything because no one has that energy

    I know people who work all the time and have energy. You have probably a mixture of privilege and exhaustion. We're talking about scanning some barcodes so you can help avoid preventing fellow human beings, including children, from being massacred.

    For example I could ask you the same regarding veganism

    I am a vegan lol

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  • [–] 7 points 8 months ago

    I don't think you have bad intent here, but I think Riverside didn't like the implication that "deep political discussions" are necessary to understand that "Israel/Palestine" is in fact "the colonial genocide of Palestinians by Israel". I think that's fair. It's OK to not want to discuss politics online, but you don't need "deep discussions" to know that colonialism is always wrong.

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  • [+] -4 points 8 months ago (32 children)
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  • [–] 7 points 8 months ago (29 children)

    piefed.social keeps a hidden trust score that goes down when people do stuff the piefed dev personally doesn't like. there was recently a bunch of drama about it

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (11 children)
  • [+] 4 points 8 months ago* (11 children)
  • [–] 14 points 8 months ago (7 children)

    Reddit Karma is not good, I don't want a Karma system on the Fediverse. That was one of the worst things about Reddit. Karma is essentially ass-kissing points, you get them for kissing ass, and you loose them for making people butt-hurt.

    I can't support that, it creates nasty psychological patterns that make people prone to siding with popularity and not with what's right.

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  • [+] -4 points 8 months ago* (7 children)
  • [–] 9 points 8 months ago (6 children)

    It's a score that is controlled by other people, which causes restrictions if it gets too low.

    It's moderation by popularity. I can't and won't support that.

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  • [+] -9 points 8 months ago (6 children)
  • [+] 6 points 8 months ago* (6 children)
  • [–] 12 points 8 months ago

    I think piefed's biggest proponents lie about this because it is one of the more unappealing aspects of piefed, and there isn't really a way to sugarcoat it. Social credit score based on the votes of others is just a shitty way of running a social platform.

    Humans as social creatures already have innate fear of social rejection, and Karma/Social Credit systems on platforms that punish rejection just feed that dark pattern even more aggressively. It's really not something I would elect to use after going through Reddit's version of Karma. Especially because Piefed's is ever more conditional (they can blacklist communities from counting towards your score positively but you still lose score points from those communities).

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  • [–] 8 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

    Why do you tankies always lie

    Amazing, I never thought I would see the day Deceptichum was called a tankie, lmao.

    The comment you linked to is written by a "tankie", by the way.

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  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago* (2 children)

    Why do you tankies always lie

    For full clarity, it was the "tankies" reporting on PieFed's social credit score system, Deceptichum is attacking the "tankie" position. The comment you linked is from a "tankie." In fact, it was because the communists started talking about PieFed's social engineering that this drama even kicked off.

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  • [+] 3 points 8 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 5 points 8 months ago

    PieFed is mainly developed by someone that hates communists to the point of regurgitating far-right conspiracy theories baked in racism. There aren't really any communist shills for PieFed that I've seen. Communists aren't a monolith, but PieFed has its social credit score system because it's run by right-wingers.

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  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (2 children)

    Then make it a clear, public figure. Make it transparent.

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  • [+] -3 points 8 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 11 points 8 months ago* (1 child)

    Because this is Lemmy, the whole point for me at least being decentralized, democratized; making non-privacy based knowledge exclusive to the effective elites goes against that principle to me. Perhaps that's not why you're here, but it does matter to me. It's the same reason I think the Modlog is a vital part of the Lemmy appeal; more transparency with users as community members, not just customers.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (16 children)
  • [–] 4 points 8 months ago (15 children)

    No they use something else for that, ie limit what new accounts can do.

    The credit score is just doing things the dev doesn't like/shouldn't be done

    https://join.piefed.social/2024/06/22/piefed-features-for-growing-healthy-communities/

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (13 children)

    There is attitude and reputation

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  • [–] 0 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (12 children)

    Yeah, did you not read why? How else do you want piefed to mitigate onetime spam accounts to sibyl downvote comments?

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (11 children)

    Do you read because that's unrelated to their spam protections.

    The scores are for activities the dev doesn't like not for spam blocking.

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  • [–] 0 points 8 months ago* (10 children)

    Again: how would you mitigate against mass onetime accounts meant to downvote specific comments fascists have been using to silence others?

    Because piefed believes monitoring the “attitude” of an account and “repudiating” it are the temporary measures for this behavior. Lemmy just let's occur, wilfully aware it persists.

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago* (9 children)

    By not making a system that helps continue that exact behavior with a system that pushes people for being downvoted that exact way or don't interact with posts how the dev wants.

    The ‘Rep’ column is their reputation. As you can see, some people have been downvoted thousands of times. They’re not going to change their ways, are they?

    The functionality is exact opposite of what you want. It's empowering mass downvoting to silence others because that's how the system is designed.

    Because piefed believes monitoring the “attitude” of an account and “repudiating” it are the temporary measures for this behavior.

    Again it's not that's the guiding principle listed for how they want to have spaces and users behave.

    And was your link to lemmy issues supposed to show something other than recent issues unrelated to the behavior?

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (7 children)

    So links to same page saying it's features made to do social media credit scores and then piefed issues?

    What are you trying to say with that?

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (5 children)

    So are just randomly replying

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (3 children)

    Bias on how piefed is set up by their own sign up page?

    I'm only replying at this point for others as you don't seem to read

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