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[–] 16 points 1 year ago (82 children)

I feel like this shouldn't have to be explained, but "Both sides bad" does not equal "Both sides equally bad" or "Both sides the same"

There's not a leftist on Lemmy who wouldn't rather be patronized while being stomped on than being cussed at while being murdered.

And yes, I voted. No, it didn't help. It was moderates who didn't vote, not leftists. Leftists believe in harm reduction while advocating for harm elimination- the two goals aren't contradictory. Trump stole the election so it's all pretty much moot anyway.

By focusing on the fact that Democrats version of bad is better than the Republican version of bad, it only helps to ensure that the Democrats are the best we can hope to achieve. There is nothing wrong in wanting actual good and instead of 'least bad'.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago* (27 children)

    Calling a genocide a genocide should not be a partisan issue, and if you think we need to temper our discussion of genocide so that your preferred genocider can win a fucking election then you are a genocide denier.

    The way for the dems to differentiate themselves on this issue was to stop doing a genocide. They couldn't do that, and so they enabled the worse option because they were just too horny for killing brown kids.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (25 children)

    You're angrier at leftists for correctly calling out the dems' genocide than you are at the dems for their genocide.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago* (15 children)

    If mentioning a genocide helped elect Trump, then doing the genocide helped Trump far more, so I don't know why you're not attacking the dems for that.

    The genocide charge wouldn't carry any weight if it wasn't true.

    Why is this genocide more important to you as a political football than as, you know, a genocide?

    You're a genocide denier. You're not denying it's happening, you're just denying it's worth talking about, which is maybe worse.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (13 children)

    So are you mad at the dems for making the genocide even worse by doing a genocide which helped them lose an election thus making the genocide worse?

    Why is it leftsts' fault for telling the truth and not dems' fault for making it true?

    Why do we have to be fair to the dems to agree that Trump's genocide would be worse when the dems worked so hard to make "worse" virtually unimaginable?

    Why do we have to be fair to you by always saying Trump is worse but you don't have to be fair to us by acknowledging that there is an actual genocide?

    Just because you have some mental gymnastics to explain why the dems' genocide is somehow something we shouldn't talk about doesn't mean you're not denying it.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (11 children)

    But every time we said the dems were doing a genocide we were supposed to say that Trump would somehow be worse, but when you complain about us talking about the dems' complicity in genocide, somehow you don't have to mention that it's a genocide? Because you didn't do that.

    And despite the fact that you acknowledge the dems are complicit in genocide, you have no criticism of that becuase... something about democracy?

    Also if the electorate wants genocide that badly, then why is it bad if we put the genocide at their feet? Aren't we helping them in that case? What are you upset about then?

    If the American people really didn't want genocide they would elect candidates in primaries that were anti genocide (they didn't) or they would vote for the candidate who wanted to just maintain the genocide as it is instead of accelerating it (they didn't).

    You should say, "Yes, that's my favourite genocider! A vote for Joe is a vote for genocide!" waves tiny plastic flag

    Your genocide apologia is breaking your brain.

    You could also learn the most basic facts about the US electoral system and understand that it is not democratic in the slightest, and people do not have a meaningful chance to vote for what they want.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (9 children)

    I think you think the electorate likes genocide, or at least you said so, so I don't understand why you think accusing Joe of genocide would have lost an election.

    If the American people really didn't want genocide they would elect candidates in primaries that were anti genocide (they didn't) or they would vote for the candidate who wanted to just maintain the genocide as it is instead of accelerating it (they didn't).

    people complaining about dems support of genocide while being silent about gop support (including "genocide Joe" chanters, 3rd party voters and non-voters), helped trump win and are responsible for the next 4 years of turbo genocide

    This isn't hard to figure out, but I guess my brain isn't broken by genocide apologia so I maybe I can't understand.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    That's weak, doesn't explain anything, and I think I'm done giving oxygen to a genocide denier.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    At least you didn't spend that comment on genocide denial, so let's call it an improvement.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    I just want to point out that you've given up trying to make an argument and are now simply calling the other person a pedophile. That's about the biggest admission you can make that you have nothing to say.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    That was me, actually, and I didn't run out, it is still valid. You are denying that we should criticise the dems for their genocide, and you haven't gone back on that. That is a kind of genocide denial.

    Your entire point in calling me a pedophile was that you literally could not substantiate it. You were talking out of your ass. You were done with any sort of argument.

    It's amazing that you don't see what that says about you, just like you don't seem to see what an absolute repudiation of the democrats it is to say that it is useless to accuse them of genocide because the choices in your "democracy" cannot exclude genocide.

    And you wonder why so many people stayed home.

    It was already turbo genocide, and the idea that what's happening now is somehow worse is just your fantasy.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    You mean the genocide that Harris said that she was going to support?

    It's always amazing to me that Democrats get mad at people who couldn't stomach voting for genocide, instead of getting mad at the people who ran a pro-genocide campaign.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    I will not, as I voted against it, which is more than the Democrats can say

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Also apparently leftists have to temper our criticism of a genocide by mentioning that Trump is always somehow worse despite there being no evidence that it is materially any worse under him - that's literally a counterfactual - but somehow this person gets to criticise us for mentioning a genocide without acknowledging that it is actually a genocide.

    It's genocide denial, but they're not denying it's happening, they're just denying that it's worth talking about, which is maybe worse?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I always read it as "It's not a big deal, as long as it's my team doing it". See also: Sending immigrants to torture prisons, rape, caring about corporations more than people, suppressing the working class, war, etc.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (51 children)

    How do you know they were leftists? I don't know where you are from, but it's been known that bots and foreign powers have been attempting to influence U.S. elections since at least Trumps first term, and let's be honest it's extremely likely that it has been going on for far longer than that.

    Biden IS pro genocide, So is Harris, So is Trump. I don't think it's bad to point that out. Using it as a reason to vote for a Fascist instead is loony tunes, and as someone who frequents Leftist spaces I can tell you not a single person on reddit or Lemmy proposed any such nonsense who was taken seriously and wasn't' immediately down-voted into oblivion.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Well, do you think it's at all likely or remotely reasonable that someone who was in favor of universal healthcare and free education would prefer a fascist dictator over a center-right Dem? It may not be possible to know for sure, but there certainly are signs.

    Were these people in r/politics or on Facebook by any chance? It's not surprising that the most popular places online to discuss politics would be a prime target for bots and Russians posing as American leftists.

    After Biden finally dropped out, I was advocating we try and get anyone other than Harris- someone who might actually win, on the ballot, but that is not the same as saying I would vote for Trump or not Vote.

    I can 100% relate to people who didn't want to vote for Harris, I didn't want to vote for her, but our election system gives us very little choice in the matter.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Maybe they didn’t vote for trump, but definitely actively discouraged people from voting blue.

    Again, I'm not sure where you are from but I'm sure its hard to understand what it's like to be an American right now. People criticize the Democrats because most of us who aren't Republicans (which lumps all Liberals in with Leftists) want better than the scraps we have been thrown.

    Every since I was a kid and able to pay attention to politics, the Democrats have been asking us to vote for someone who is problematic, but better than the alternative. "Vote the lesser of two evils" they say, or you will be handing the country over to a monster. And every election the Dems head more and more to the right. But in the Land of the Free we have no fucking other alternatives. We either accept the shit that is forced upon us, or allow a monster to rule. So no, putting Democrats on blast for 'not being perfect' is not the same thing as discouraging people to vote.

    How many times did you ask yourself if the comment you are reading might have come from and been upvoted by a bot or foreign agent? Because Americans do have to be vigilant for that. Also, it's highly likely that republicans reading such a comment would upvote it as well.

    every new gop fuck up asking why democrats didn’t do anything to stop it.

    You don't think that its the Democrats job to try and stop the GOP? You don't think that's what the people who voted for them want them to do? If you look at those comments chances are they are complaining about the Democrats who are actually not doing anything to try and stop it. We aren't asking that about the ones who are trying but failing.

    I cannot support biden (later Harris) because they are not perfect on issue X

    I wish it were as simple as 'not being perfect'. I would kill to have a party I could vote for that was 99% of the way there. Fuck I'd be happy with 70% honestly. I don't blame you for not keeping a super close eye on American politics, but Biden is one of the people directly responsible for our disgusting, ill conceived, immoral, ineffective, and harmful 'War on Drugs'. He's part of the reason violence is as high as it is. He's one of the people directly responsible for the insane incarceration rates. He helped make it legal for the cops to LITERALLY steal from Americans. "Not perfect"? Fuck off with that shit.

    Harris isn't any better, as California's AG she fought the Supreme Court for YEARS to keep human beings locked up in prisons so overcrowded that even the SCOTUS ruled that it was 'Cruel and Unusual Punishment' (that's actually illegal here believe it or not) Why? So she could use those prisoners as literal slave labor (We didn't get rid of Slavery entirely in the U.S., it's still ok if the Government does it). She also fought to make 'Civil Asset Forfeiture' even easier for the cops (the whole "it's legal for the cops to steal from you" thing). She's a 'Tough on Crime' right winger and always has been, despite what Fox news has to say about her. She and Biden were perfect- for each other.

    As you rightly point out what passes for 'the left' in America is considered centrist in Europe, and you want us to what? Thank our lucky stars that the Democrats aren't literal fascists? Are we supposed to just accept worse and worse out of the DNC until one day we are voting for literal fascists because the alternative is a super-ultra-mega fascist?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (43 children)

    I think you might be reading too much into that statement. They were saying that the Democrats have failed to differentiate themselves on that specific issue, and that's an objective fact.

    They also said that Trump was the worst option.

    I agree with them that we shouldn't have to keep quiet about what a shit human being politician A is, on the off chance that it might cause a complete idiot to vote for politician B who is just as bad on that issue and worse in just about every other way.

    An idiot is going to idiot no matter what you do, and it's not on us to cover up for liberals and their shit candidates.

    If the Democrats want us to stop discussing what trash human beings their candidates are, there is a simple solution for that. I'm sure you can figure out what that is if you think about it.

    No matter where you are in the world, this is going to affect you as well. You should be just as mad at the Democrats for putting an unelectable piece of shit up against Trump as I am, not making excuses for them and blaming leftists. We didn't have Jack shit to do with it.

    The DNC had ONE job, put up a candidate that could beat a fascist dictator. That should have been the easiest job in the world.

    They fucked up. And now we are all paying for it. Quit trying to shift the blame where it doesn't belong.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (41 children)

    "The American People" are not a monolith, we are actually composed of a diverse group of hundreds of millions of people. Blaming every person in the country for the actions of some is reductive, myopic, and ignorant.

    Your uninformed take is about as nuanced as claiming Sophie Scholl was just as responsible for The 3rd Reich as Adolf Hitler because she didn't do more to stop him.

    Who knows, given your utter lack of understanding, you might well believe that.

    I've already explained in great detail how it actually is the DNC and not the voters who decides who wins the primaries. If your reading comprehension is really that lacking, I'm not sure I can help you with your problem. If you still don't understand try having an adult explain it to you.

    Good Luck with whatever your issue is. Hopefully you are fortunate enough to live somewhere that you have access to good mental health treatment.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (37 children)

    You can blame a group without blaming every single member of the group individually.

    What an ignorant statement lmfao. When you blame an entire group of people for something, that includes all of the individuals within that group. It's like if you said "All Berries are gross" but then I say "What about Blueberries" and you respond with "I didn't mean Blueberries". If you said "Most Berries are gross" or "Some Berries are gross" or "All Berries are gross with the exception of Blueberries" that would be a different story, because words have meanings.

    "The American People" are no more responsible for Trump being elected than "The German People" were responsible for the Nazi's or "Everyone who works for BP" is responsible for Oil spills.

    Your lame attempt to use semantic wordplay to backpedal your moronic "Leftists Got Trump Elected" claim might have held more weight if the context of the entire conversation wasn't already which specific groups within the U.S. are responsible for Trump being elected.

    Blaming "U.S. Leftists" for Trump is every bit as reasonable as blaming "The White Rose" for the Nazi's or "Joe the Janitor" for the Deepwater Horizon. My assertion that lumping all Americans together as if we are a homogeneous group is reductive, myopic, and ignorant stands.

    Public education in the US really sucks, huh?

    It sure does, my guess is you were 'educated' here and were bougie enough to afford to emigrate to somewhere in Europe that is a much more normal place to live than the U.S. and now you sit around in your place of privilege judging the people in the country you abandoned when you aren't sniffing your own farts. It's either that or you are one of those uppity Europeans who believes your country has always been perfect and you are better than Americans because you happened to not be born in crazy town and your education system isn't all it's cracked up to be.

    Congratulations on your sense of superiority, I'm sure you believe you have earned it.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (35 children)

    Maybe because you are speaking of things that you obviously haven't the foggiest clue about as if you are an expert on them.

    If you are saying you aren't American, that's sad. I guess the Education systems in Europe aren't as grand as they are made out to be.

    You know where I'm from, don't be a coward- state where you are from- I'm sure your country and people are 100% perfect and always have been.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (33 children)

    Yes, it is quite Ironic that you seem to spend all your time online criticizing the U.S. when you are too much of a chicken shit to even mention where you are from. Weird. I wonder why that is?

    What a fucking minute, you are a god damn Kraut aren't you? LMFAO 🤣 No wonder you wouldn't say. This is too precious.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (31 children)

    Don't bullshit me Jerry, and don't flatter yourself.

    I really don't give a shit what you are about, you are clearly a foreign agent trying to influence American politics with strawman arguments and only the most superficial understanding of how things work, so your opinion means less than nothing.

    You sound just like a MAGAt, ignoring facts just to trumpet your own sad version of reality. Pathetic

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (29 children)

    would like Americans to elect smarter people. I’ll settle for less evil. Hell, at this point I’ll settle for competent.

    As would the majority of Americans. You know what's not going to help with that? Ignorant ass jerk offs trying to put the meme into peoples heads that the fact that the DNC propped up a authoritarian pro-slavery pig was fine and good actually. That the fucking committee that literally runs the elections and admitted in Federal Court that they choose who the Dem candidate is going to be has no bearing on who wins the primaries. That billionaires and corporations have zero interest in politics and are good guys actually who don't put massive resources into controlling the narrative. That the Russians who we know for a fact are interfering with U.S. politics are just innocent bystanders, despite Trump publicly calling on Russia to interfere with the elections. That it's actually Leftists who voted for Trump and the liberal corporate bootlickers are the good guys trying to fight the good fight and actually want change, and whatever other smooth brained takes you pulled out of your 'educated' ass.

    Maybe take a look at why the AfD is gaining more and more support each election and try to figure out a way to put a stop to that bullshit before you find yourself in the exact same situation we are in or worse, and leave U.S. politics to people with the capacity for rational thought, that will help a lot more than your misinformation campaign on Lemmy.

    Have the day you voted for!

    Eat shit Adolf

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (28 children)

    Nah, the majority of Americans chose trump (or staying at home). Of voters, 77 vs 75. I don't vote in German elections (because I'm not German), but the AfD being at 30% or Le Pen being at 33% is way preferable to being at 58% like trumps victory.

    Keep blaming Russians, dems,consultants, billionaires, news and Soros, but trump was elected by the American public, so again, have the day you voted for!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (27 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (26 children)

    You really wish I was German, huh? Americans are so fixated with ethnicity and race, just like Germans. But 90 years ago.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (25 children)

    It's ok kleiner dummkopf, I get it. I'd be embarrassed to admit it myself If I were you, it's not like you make them look good.

    I would point out that it's clearly not just Americans who grow garbage humans, but for that to be effective you would have to posses even the tiniest shred of empathy or compassion for you fellow man, but sure. Sit back and eat your popcorn and laugh as families are ripped apart, as protestors are beaten, as they call the military in to brutalize the very liberals you have been breaking your neck trying to excuse. Eat your Caviar and drive your Beemer and just chuckle at how funny it is that Palestinian children are starving to death, how their parents were murdered in cold blood. Blame all the people who actually tried to stop it- unlike heroic keyboard warriors like you who heroically typed your liberal capitalist boot licking propaganda, trying to sew division between two groups that actually united to try and stop a fascist dictator, despite their differences. You are no better than a MAGAt. Go back to sniffing your own farts and feeling superior.

    I bet you blame the East Germans for Stalin taking over. The Native Americans for the European Colonists, the Black folks for slavery. Go ahead tell me how it was the Jews fault for Hitler, because after all, they were a part of the Wiemar Republic and didn't vote hard enough against him.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (24 children)

    I might be German in a few years, it's an awesome country. Just a lot paperwork to get the nationality.

    Families ripped apart, protestors beaten and all the other things already happened last time Trump was president. And people vote for him MORE this time around. So have the day you voted for.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (23 children)

    Good Job Klaus, that's just exactly the amount of empathy and compassion I'm talking about.

    I didn't vote for him you smooth brained piece of Scheiße, but keep telling yourself that and living in denial, I'm sure that's much better than growing a conscience.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (21 children)

    i WaS aLmOsT hUmAn 9 yEaRs AgO, nOw I jErK oFf To MuRdErEd ChILdReN wHiLe I ChOkE oN dIeTeR sChWaRz BaLlS.

    hAvE tHe DaY yOu VoTeD fOr!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (20 children)

    I would like less murdered children, but Americans decided otherwise. And now they blame the black lady for their own choice. At least we get a trump hotel in Gaza, yay!

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (19 children)

    oH wOnT sOmEbOdY tHiNk Of ThE pOoR aUtHoRiTaRiAn, PrO sLaVeRy, PrO gEnOcIdE pIG?! hEr GeNoCiDe WoUlD hAvE bEeN pReFeRaBlE!

    I'm sure the ghosts of all the murdered Palestinians would thank you for advocating they build vacation homes for rich Zionists in Gaza rather than a hotel. You are such a humanitarian!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (18 children)

    Yes, less genocide is preferable to more genocide. Such a radical idea, huh?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (17 children)

    I don't know how you got it in your head that under a Harris regime there would be 'less genocide', but maybe if you pulled your head out of your ass you might realize how fucking stupid you sound. Genocide is genocide. There's no such thing as a kinder, gentler genocide.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (16 children)

    Every person not ethnically cleansed is a win, but you don't care, world is black and white I guess?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (15 children)

    Every person not ethnically cleansed is a win

    And you have exactly zero evidence that there would be fewer Palestinians ethnically cleansed under a Harris regime, just like everything else in this conversation you pulled that fact straight out of your Popo.

    but you don’t care

    Hilarious for a psychopath who admitted that it hasn't had empathy or compassion in 6 years. A heartless jackass who eats popcorn and laughs while reading about U.S. atrocities.

    world is black and white I guess?

    Oh, you mean exactly like how you refuse to admit to any nuance or extenuating circumstances when it comes to U.S. elections? How Trump getting elected is the fault of every single American except for Kamala Harris and the members of the DNC?

    What an amazing fucking hypocrite you are! lmfao How much do you get paid for every moronic comment you make? Your overtime check will be amazing this week.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (14 children)

    Trump and Bibi announced a textbook ethnic cleansing, Harris had no such plans.

    I have empathy for innocent people in Gaza being murdered and starved. I don't have empathy for moronic americans getting the consequences of their own actions. Easy enough, right?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (13 children)

    Trump and Bibi announced a textbook ethnic cleansing, Harris had no such plans.

    Source: Your asshole

    I have empathy for innocent people in Gaza being murdered and starved.

    Doubt. You have no empathy for innocent people in the U.S., nothing leads me to believe you are capable of empathy. Besides by your own logic the Palestinians are responsible for Israel being in power, so I'm sure you blame them and think they are getting what they deserve.

    I don’t have empathy for moronic americans getting the consequences of their own actions.

    And you also don't have empathy for the non-moronic Americans whose actions had nothing at all to do with Trump getting elected, and in fact whose actions directly opposed Trump getting elected. Except of course for your beloved DNC, whose actions did in fact lead to Trump being elected. The hypocrisy is palpable.

    Must be nice to feel so superior than millions of people simply by being privileged enough to not be born in the U.S. I'm sure an idiot such as yourself has very little to feel superior about, so enjoy it. You've 'earned' it.

    Easy enough, right?

    Easy for a heartless, brainless, spinless piece of shit I guess.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (12 children)

    Nah, you get what you vote for. Tax breaks for the rich, ICE raids for the poor, and extra genocide? You got it. If the people wanted universal Healthcare and cancelation of student debt they would have voted for it.

    Aka, have the day you voted for!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (11 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (10 children)

    I don't think it was an accident, the second time around it was deliberate.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (9 children)

    You deliberately gave yourself brain damage?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (8 children)

    If I had brain damage I would think voting for trump is a good alternative to democrats. Or I would blame others for the consequences of my own actions.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (7 children)

    If I had brain damage I would think voting for trump is a good alternative to democrats.

    If that's directed at me you are an even bigger moron that I thought, and that is quite the accomplishment. Well done 👏

    Or I would blame others for the consequences of my own actions.

    Instead, you are blaming 10's of millions of people for other peoples actions, which is even fucking stupider. You are blaming the people who did the thing you wanted them to do, for the actions of the people who did what you didn't want them to do. That's worse than shifting the blame, which you are very much doing, that's worse than denying reality, which you are also doing. It's dumber than even moronic MAGAt level of reasoning, because as flawed and ignorant as it is at least there is some level of reasoning going on there.

    You are just responding to objectively true facts by ignoring them and repeating your stupid fucking catch phrase as if you've actually made a point. It's intellectual equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and shouting "La, La, La, I can't heeear you!" That's some kindergartner level shit right there. Even then I know some kindergartners who are more mature and more capable of abstract thought than you are.

    To call it stupid, is an insult to the stupid. It's worse than even being willfully ignorant, because you are fully aware that what you are saying is bullshit, yet miraculously you somehow you still believe that you have scored a point. I can see you now, drooling into your cum stained panties and clapping for yourself at the 'zinger' you just typed out, while grinning like an idiot.

    hAvE tHe DaY yOu VoTeD fOr! 🤣

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (5 children)
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