Dumb question: how is this affecting projects like Graphene OS?
Can android just be forked and detached from google?
I am guessing that despite being "open source", the project depends on many binary blobs to interface with the wireless devices ??
Dumb question: how is this affecting projects like Graphene OS?
Can android just be forked and detached from google?
I am guessing that despite being "open source", the project depends on many binary blobs to interface with the wireless devices ??
And I'm already steadily moving to Linux based platforms like Mobian, SailfishOS, Ubuntu Touch, and others.
This vile move by Google was written on the wall for years. Those who use their products are test subjects who then are promoted to cattle, not customers.
Which devices do you use? I really want to do this but need banking stuff, WhatsApp (for family communication) and the phone on my Pixel 7 is really good so dont want to lose that.
Not OP, but when i was running custom ROMs on my main device I carried 2 devices, i had my main phone in my pocket and my secondary in my purse. The secondary ran "Android" so i could use tap pay and the like.
You said 'When' - does that mean you stopped?
Yeah, i just run a very heavily modified android now. Hard to find good phones (with features that i want and need) with enough software support. Couldn't get lineage os working on my zenfone, it was a horribly buggy experience and I couldn't get mobile networks working. I needed more reliability and stability, so i manually debloated and stripped almost all telemetry. Rooted this thing and blocked anything that isn't whitelisted.
I have a Pixel 7 I've been dailying for over a year with GrapheneOS. All my banking apps work great in their segregated profile and even Android Auto. I don't use WhatsApp, I've converted my friends and family to Signal. Your mileage may obviously vary, but definitely consider it. Graphene doesn't address the meat of this post (Google fucking Android), but definitely helps for the interim (until Linux phones are truly viable).
Run any Android specific apps in Waydroid (e.g. WhatsApp) and it appears as just another icon in your app drawer, or use a web app, again you can make it a dedicated icon in your app drawer.
Unfortunately Google Pixel 7 is not a device supported yet on any distros I've seen; PostmarketOS has the best support for Android devices. Across distros, Fairphone has the best support.
What people with Android devices can do though, is install Linux on top of Android. Opposite of Waydroid (not as good), but at least lets you play around with it to get familiar without needing root:
Graphene runs on pixel and has a step by step guide on how to install it. You can also put your banking apps in another profile with Google Play services in it or run Google Play services in a sandbox on your main profile (I believe you can set that up when setting up the phone it's just a toggle switch).
I will say my pixel 6 runs significantly better with graphene than my 8 does with regular Android and it was easy to install to test drive. I did have an issue with Android Auto but I have to check again to see if I fixed it.
I’ve said on a few occasions when this subject came up about them closing off the ability to install whatever you want - the only reason Android has been what it is until now is because they needed an “in” to compete against iOS and Windows. Gaining a foothold was the priority, but now that they’re huge they can do what they’ve always wanted, to follow Apple’s example of mandatory middle-man.
It’s sickening. What people need to do is only buy second-hand and use devices that can be ROM-ed. I have a couple dozen that I tinker with and test stuff on. I also buy older models, put custom ROMs and Recovery and then sell them at a small premium, but I digress.
There’s only one way to get what you want as a consumer: unite and don’t buy.
Honestly we need operating systems to be regulated to have the freedom to install any app you want without the company's permission. Maybe not all of them, but any provided with a general computation device such as a computer or smartphone, and the freedom to replace operating systems on any device that isn't highly specialized with immediate safety concerns (stuff like insulin pump systems and cars)
fuck google and fuck android.
donate to https://postmarketos.org/ (and any of the great opensource mobile projects).
stop begging for longer chains and bigger cages.
Lowkey postmarketos isnt where its at sorry i think mobian would be better because look at debian, ubuntu made it better but not quite there and then we got mint and zorin. I think the same will happen mobian and postmarket is based on mobian. Also kde and gnome are the one that need the funding since they run the gui/desktop environment.
Fuck Google. Can't we fork their shit? Let them close their platform while we keep it open.
Or... just don't use android. There's a few degoogled forks out there, they should really catch on.
"The tighter you squeeze, the more slips through your fingers."
Also, we all know this isn't about keeping malicious apps off people's devices, because even the play store is full of malicious apps. I'd trust anything on F-droid more.
I trust 8 year old out of date F-droid apps more than google play front page apps.
They are, graphene will be getting a side launch with a major distributor about a year a after launch and you can mamual install it when the flagship is released. The reason google phones buy is so people can install graphen lol.
Any update on what the Grapheme phone will be? Have not heard of it since it was announced
I'm glabbergasted that this is the first time I'm hearing about this, while it's been known since november.
Don't interrupt your enemies when they are making mistakes. Let Google make this mistake and the EU fuck them up.
What are you talking about ?
What do you not understand?
I think they were asking you to elaborate
@mEEGal@lemmy.world Google has been allowed to operate this way because they are the only real alternative to Apple. If that alternative disappears, it will pressure either the community to rally and create awareness, for it to work on alternatives, or (and this is my bet) for a bigger instance like that of an EU nation or the EU itself, to step in. Since the EU is beginning to see the US threat and voices for digital sovereignty are getting louder, such a move by Google could realistically draw the attention of the EU Commission, parliament, and courts.
However, that can only happen if Google makes the mistake. If we prevent it from making the mistake, it will have moved the Overton window enough to make the situation worse than it is now, but not as bad as it could've been. So we'll just end up with a worse situation and no political nor judicial attention. Google will have boiled the frog.
The short term gain of Google backing off will offset the long-term gain of a real solution.
We saw what it's doing for Microslop with their forceful introduction of windows 11...
Thank you for elaborating
I think you make good points, but I'm still convinced pushing back is necessary. It may not be enough, but it will at least make some of our voices heard.
Then the EU has 3 options :
It does nothing because it doesn't even think it's a problem (e.g they seem to think this about Apple, because they do the same thing. Correct me if I'm wrong)
It tries tu regulate it, but fails because of Google's lobbying and possibly corruption
It successfully breaks Googles fingers and gives back freedom co the consumer.
I personnally wouldn't try to pass the breaking point hoping for the best. I'm more of a pessimist: I'd rather fight, thinking of the worst outcome but still hoping to be wrong (if that makes sense)
I think that's a fairly good take. It's also fairly accelerationist, rather than pushing back the other way. What about the momentum and awareness that would be gained by publicly pushing back against Google to a level to force them to recant the policy? In other words, why don't you think an iterative approach is better than letting the bad stuff happen and then having to essentially start over, and risking all sorts of other problems?
It's kind of like having a car with serious issues. And you either drive it until it explodes and you get in a car accident, or you pump time and money into it and fix it? Except the car is also you and you need to grow in order to learn to stop using sawdust instead of oil.
If a mistake harms people, it should be stopped.
From the FAQ page
Sideloading is fundamental to Android, and it's not going anywhere.
What's the concern here?
The problem is that "not going anywhere" doesn't mean it won't get severely restricted, and that they're still gonna force devs to verify before being able to distribute an app.
It doesn't mean that it will be severely restricted either.
What's wrong with making devs verify? How does that hurt the end user if side loading still works?
Because it exposes devs of projects that may not want to be exposed such as ICE trackers. Furthermore it gives Google veto power over whst you can sideload
These questions are always asked in the opposite direction. What's right with making devs verify? What does it gain an end user?
You think AI app slop is good? Cause that's all you'll have if literally anyone can just put an app into whatever store they want.
So let the app stores sort that out. If Google wants signing on play store then fine. Don't force it on people who don't want it.
This isn't about the play store: it's about installing anything at all. I couldn't care less if AI slop is on the play store though to answer your question
If someone makes an app and I want to install it, that's between me and the developer.
What's wrong with making devs verify?
It's just okay to you if an unwanted third wheel wants the power to choose which developers apps I can install? They also conveniently collect a fee for it.

It's a curated app store. App devs are still free to just not put it on that store and host it themselves. You can definitely keep it between you and the dev.
But this has nothing to do with a curated app store? Nobody is complaining about play store verification. Google is planning to block "unverified" developers' apps from being installed at all, from any source.
This is not about Google Play it's an OS level thing.
Nobody saying it definitely will be either, but that there's a possibility and that's what the concern is.
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