269
Banned from LateStageCapitalism@lemmy.world for promoting voter turnout in tandem with other activism. (slrpnk.net)
submitted 2 weeks ago by to c/yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com
156 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

The power trip / ban doesn't bother me, but the misinformation does. They present as leftist, but flare up around US elections discouraging voter turnout via 'bOtH siDeS' garbage. that only ever elevates shit like MAGA.

In the linked thread, OP promotes rioting while discouraging voter turnout. My comments agreed with activism like riots, but pointed out that it's not an either-or thing. You can riot -and- vote; and even if you don't have it in you to riot, still do vote.

Banned.

You can see my removed comment quoted in the post after mine.

This 'blue MAGA' tankie shit is somehow worse than the loud-and-clear MAGA shit over on Reddit - at least those neonazis were honest about who they were.

Anywho, YSK. Spaces like r/conservative were clearly labeled and easy to avoid; LateStageCapitalism@lemmy.world presents as a cause worth rallying around, but only until you peel up the veneer and see that they're the same fucking thing.

Also please vote. In addition to whatever flavor of activism tickles your fancy.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [S] 5 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Vote for whoever has the best shot of keeping the greater evil out of office

I fail to see how that’s not lesser-evil rhetoric.

That's because you're assuming the lesser evil is always the one in second place. If you don't think any 3rds have the potential to break into that coveted political standing between the red and blue teams, that's on you.

My posts only expressed hostility to MAGA, which summoned defensive tankies like a swarm of flies closing in on a freshly dropped turd. The longer I'm on this website, the more I'm noticing that behavior. It's gotten to the point that I'm questioning if "tankies" are even a thing, or if that's just a shitty attempt to conceal their red caps and klan robes under a poorly executed online persona for 'lols'.

I digress - my suspicion of tankies is off topic, outside of their overt and consistent support for MAGA and ilk, which I did call out in the previous thread.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 5 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child)

    My posts only expressed hostility to MAGA, which summoned defensive tankies like a swarm of flies closing in on a freshly dropped turd.

    I mean, what you said here was:

    This 'blue MAGA' tankie shit is somehow worse than the loud-and-clear MAGA shit over on Reddit

    Like it's not only campists who use the terminology "blue MAGA". Anarchists and other non-campist revolutionaries rightly use the terminology (although I would personally not label someone reluctantly going to the polls as "Blue MAGA"; I would use that term for someone more emphatic and supportive of the policies that liberal politicians are responsible for). Followed by

    • at least those neonazis were honest about who they were.

    Like can you see where I'm coming from here? If you really didn't mean to call all anti-electoralists neo-nazis then... okay I guess, but that's not how I read it.

    Tbh, that's really what motivated me to speak up. Like I'm willing to agree to disagree with my comrades about whether or not they individually show up to the polls, even though my viewpoint is emphatically against electoralism as praxis, but I (and I think some other people) read your post as if you were comparing your anti-electoralist comrades to neo-nazis.

    It's gotten to the point that I'm questioning if "tankies" are even a thing, or if that's just a shitty attempt to conceal their red caps and klan robes under a poorly executed online persona for 'lols'.

    I mean, from an anarchist perspective ... it's not at all shocking that people have recognized that some hierarchies are unacceptable while not (yet?) realizing that the State is inherently one such hierarchy, which is itself responsible for maintaining those other hierarchies. For a different example, many liberals clearly recognize that racism and sexism and homophobia are unjustifiable hierarchies, to the point that some are even doing very noble work in stopping ICE...but they still have not figured out the underlying pattern (hierarchical social relations).

    The campists you're running into here are probably not Trump supporters. It's just that..."America bad" is a correct answer 99% of the time, and 99% is good enough for some people to round it up to 100%. (And even in the 0.1% where it's not the correct answer...it is true because America is bad, it's just not a helpful answer.) IMO campism is a cognitive distortion, but it's understandable where it comes from.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] [S] 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

    Like it’s not only campists who use the terminology “blue MAGA”. Anarchists and other non-campist revolutionaries rightly use the terminology (although I would personally not label someone reluctantly going to the polls as “Blue MAGA”; I would use that term for someone more emphatic and supportive of the policies that liberal politicians are responsible for).

    I may be misusing the term? My understanding (gained entirely through context in posts like this discussion - so if it was misused in those cases, then I'm parroting an error) is that it's kind of false flag effort to lure anyone left of the fascists currently running the country to dispersing their support to a wider array of easier-to-defeat opponents. Divide and conquer kinda situation. Idk if there's any kind of 'coined' meaning, I thought it was just internet slang.

    Like can you see where I’m coming from here? If you really didn’t mean to call all anti-electoralists neo-nazis then… okay I guess, but that’s not how I read it.

    I do see where your coming from. And frankly I agree with a lot of it, which is why the idea of 'blue MAGA' (or whatever we're calling the shit I described above) is getting me so worked up: it's deceptive, with the goal of tricking actually decent people into supporting something awful.

    In any case -- All anti-electoralists? certainly not. Anti-electoralism isn't what I have an issue with. You're sick of being forced to choose any evil, lesser or otherwise. I get the fuck out of that. The state of our elections is abysmal, in which "vote for me because I'm not the other guy" is often the literal only selling point. It's exhausting, it doesn't work, it needs to go away. The shitty reality is that we're in that system whether we like it or not; and the options presented within are NOT equal - one of those options of going full Nazi right now, and when I call MAGA Nazis, I'm not saying that as an insult, I'm saying they're actually acting like Nazis. If we're a given any power at all that be used against Nazis, we should use it whether or not we approve of the system it exists in.

    In short, I agree with your disapproval of the process; it's shit. I disagree with the notion that participating in voting is equal to supporting that system. We (collectively) need to be more strategic with our resources. Vote for the least shit option within a shit system; riot to break the system and reform it into something that's actually humane.

    recognized that some hierarchies are unacceptable while not (yet?) realizing that the State is inherently one such hierarchy

    I kinda got ahead of myself with the previous paragraphs, but basically the same spiel here. There's no shame in participating in a system that you're stuck in anyway, especially if that participation can nudge it away from Nazism.

    The campists you’re running into here are probably not Trump supporters.

    ...I mean, hopefully not. I try to give anyone the benefit of the doubt by default (although that's feeling increasingly naive). Yourself included. What I have to question though, is what's the goal? Especially here - Lemmy seems to be a mostly left-leaning space, so spreading notions of a false equivalence between Trump/his mini-Nazis, with is going to detract from the effort to oppose him. And even if you intend to engage in other more impactful, high-risk-high-reward activism, why skip the vote? Voting is way less effort and way less risk, and I can't stress this enough, doesn't stop you from any other action.

    It’s just that…“America bad” is a correct answer 99% of the time, and 99% is good enough for some people to round it up to 100%. (And even in the 0.1% where it’s not the correct answer…it is true because America is bad, it’s just not a helpful answer.) IMO campism is a cognitive distortion, but it’s understandable where it comes from.

    America bad. I get it. Let's maybe try to make it not bad. Or at least less bad to start with. Discouraging voter turnout isn't going to accomplish that.

    Edit - I just saw the mod post here warning against soap-boxing about voting, which is 100% what you and I are doing. We should probably move this conversation to PMs if you want to keep it rolling. We're getting way outside the scope of what I posted in LSC.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent