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The conversation so many people are simply not ready for (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 month ago by to c/childfree@lemmy.world
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PS: The point here is NOT that poor people shouldn't have kids, it's that no one should be having kids without having the basics of childcare covered, which necessitates widespread systemic, societal, and economic change so that no parent needs to worry about those basics, and kids can grow up in secure, healthy environments. I completely forgot to mention this when I originally posted it, and that's my bad.

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[–] [S] 23 points 1 month ago (7 children)

Sure. But choice and logic also exist in human beings, and those more than anything else are what set us apart from other life forms. "We'll figure it out" is not a plan, it's an almost surefire way to fuck up your kid one way or another.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 month ago*

    Yeah, my parents didn’t “just figure it out,” they put a ton of planning, care, and money into raising me. I’m grateful and my life has been pretty awesome. But, since I make so much less money than they do, don’t own a house like they do, etc, it would be difficult-to-impossible to repeat. So I don’t.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 month ago

    Well by that "logic" no one should have kids, because you can't control everything. You can't control if your country goes to war, or if your spouse dies (or if you both die), you can't control if you get bankrupted by surprise medical bills or if your community is devastated by a natural disaster. When I was already pregnant my husband's company (and others in his field) had mass layoffs. He ended up moving out of tech and into a trade when there were no positions open. It's been some awfully tight years while he's been apprenticing, but our kids are thriving. We'll figured it out mentality is actually the most important thing when having kids.

    It's people who don't plan to figure it out who shouldn't have them.

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  • [+] -16 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    Hardships and challenges can also build character, drive innovation, and lead to many unpredictable things.

    The previous gen of my family grew up in public housing and in poverty but are now multi-millionaires (8 digit networth).

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  • [–] 19 points 1 month ago

    The previous gen of my family grew up in public housing and in poverty but are now multi-millionaires (8 digit networth).

    That's great and all, but you need to acknowledge that isn't normal or achievable for most people in that situation.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago

    Anyone who succeeds in an environment like that would have succeeded even more in a more positive environment. Hardships are never a good thing. Some people flourish anyway, in the same way that some folks don’t let chronic illness or disability stop them. It doesn’t mean we have to celebrate the chronic illness or disability (or poverty). We celebrate the people who achieved greatness in spite of it.

    I spent years of my life in hard situations. I got out of them eventually, but it just made me want to do better by other folks. There is no magic “shitty situation makes you a better person,” lots of my peers became deeply selfish & bitter.

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