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Vitamin B12 derived from geneticaly modified spirulina (scitechdaily.com)
submitted 6 months ago by to c/vegan@slrpnk.net
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I don't need to explain why this is huge!

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[–] [S] 9 points 6 months ago (19 children)

Plants literally just don't have B12 vitamin. You can't have a steady pure-vegan diet without supplements.

Or at least you could not before. Now, once this becomes commercialized, you will be able to just buy a complete diet!

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  • [–] 7 points 6 months ago (15 children)

    Is there an advantage of buying 'artificial' plants rather than straight up buying vitamins? For me buying special B12 algae would be quite similar to 'regular' supplements.

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 6 months ago (11 children)

    The algae are natural, except they are modified so you can actually absorb the B12 vitamin from them. B12 pills are less appealing within a soup than an algae.

    Also, you absorb the vitamins in a natural way, instead of all at once. So it is better for your health.

    Supplements are the option you choose only when you have no other, and there is research showing how it is bad for your health.

    I'm guessing easier to produce than vitamin pills as well.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (8 children)

    If you don't like pills, there's also powder, drops etc. that you can take instead and which you can also add to your food or drinks. There's also vegan milk alternatives and convenience food that already has B12 included.

    If I wanted to supply my needs with algae only, I'd probably also want them in a powdered form or similar as fresh algae - even if refrigerated - turn bad pretty quickly.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm happy if they invented another vegan source for B12, I just don't see the huge difference or advantage compared to status quo.

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  • [–] [S] 1 point 6 months ago (7 children)

    The main argument that vegans can't survive on just a vegan diet, is now moot. Though with the caveat that this is technologically intensive. Also, vegans could technically survive with certain plants like Chlorella.

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (6 children)

    From my perspective that argument is pretty stupid in the first place and just a smokescreen to object a vegan diet. Those people will either not listen to facts at all or find new reasons to justify an omnivore diet.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    A 100% vegan diet shouldn't be the goal.

    Converting 10 people to a 90% vegan diet is more achievable than making 9 people 100% vegan.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    I agree, but I don't understand how this contradicts my comment. People who insist that 'veganism is unnatural because you should supplement B12' never did the slightest research.

    • B12 is mostly produced by bacteria, mostly living on and around the roots of trees and smaller plants.
    • It is naturally contained in animal products if the animals are free roaming in the nature and eating these roots and the dirt with the bacteria and B12 that sticks to these roots.
    • Animals in the food industry mostly do not have the opportunity to eat wild plants and roots and thus would have a B12 deficiency just like vegan humans.
    • To address this issue the livestock is fed with B12 supplements.
    • Only because of these supplements, industrial animal products contain significant levels of B12.
    • So omnivores add the supplements to their food just like vegans do. It's just as 'unnatural'.
    • Furthermore, also many omnivores have a B12 deficiency and would benefit from supplementation.

    There's absolutely no issue to supplement nutrients as long as it's a reasonable dose corresponding to your needs.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

    I agree, but I don't understand how this contradicts my comment.

    Wasn't trying to prove you wrong. I was trying to say that Vegan + a bit of cheese (b12) is perfectly fine for the "can't do vegan" people.

    Similarly, people who can't live without their steak/burger/bacon. Fine. Only have it once a week, or once a month.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (2 children)

    Thank you for communicating, I appreciate the creative wordplay in your username!

    For all eternity, I believe, we can very well aim towards fueling our metabolisms (popularly referred to as eating) kindly, thus; ethically, and completely vegan.

    While indeed presently beginning wherever, and with whatever we can. All the best! • ♡ ☻ ❂

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Perfect is the enemy of good.

    Personally we can aim for 100% but we are more likely to influence someone from carnivore -> 90% vegan than carnivore -> 100% vegan.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    I assume perfect derives from per facere (latin) in which case:

    Perfect ~ it/he/she has created (or accomplished or any other synonym) through action.

    I find value in viewing it as 'it' has created through action. Viewing 'It' as הַשֵּׁם (phonetically HaShem, Hebrew literally "the Name" (for G-D))

    And subsequentially perceiving it as having realized הַשֵּׁם in existence through action, which I deem fully doable, and given the eternity it allows to create in, realizable with ease.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (2 children)

    in short: I assume chlorella is more cost-effective for you and producers, and more aligned with our environment.

    When you want to, I can recommend to further look into it, and there probably is a lot I did not mention: Chlorella, in natural circumstances, contains vitamin B12 — seemingly synthesized by bacteriae in chlorella's habitat — and according to the publication (I linked below) even contains precursors to, ánd vitamin D(2) itself.

    It has an outstanding nutrient profile — as mentioned in a previous comment 3g of it fulfills the Reference Daily Intake (RDI) of B12.

    I will follow up with a few assumptions mixed with references and a quote from the study regarding advantages of chlorella:

    • I see the more natural way of chlorella production as an advantage.
    • I assume it grows cost-effective as it "can be mass-cultured" (according to the linked publication).
    • It contains a super dense and rich nutrient profile, covering a wide variety of micronutrients as the publication shows — a more convenient view on the (micro-)nutrients and how they relate to RDI can easily get accessed with a (Brave) Leo Community Intelligence prompt (yes, I refer to 'AI' that way) or any other Community Intelligence prompt.
    • I (not knowing the prices of fabricated supplements) assume it costs less for the consumer to add 3g of algae to the diet than a plethora of pills to cover all the nutrients chlorella provides.

    Bonus: As also mentioned in the publication: shiitake and other mushrooms can contain Vitamin D after Sun (or other UV-light exposure). I see a complete plant-based, natural, and vegan diet as perfectly possible and eat that way myself, pretty happily so.

    I hope I provided valuable assistance in any way.

    https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7551956/

    [1](Bito T, Okumura E, Fujishima M, Watanabe F. Potential of Chlorella as a Dietary Supplement to Promote Human Health. Nutrients. 2020 Aug 20;12(9):2524. doi: 10.3390/nu12092524. PMID: 32825362; PMCID: PMC7551956.)

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    seemingly synthesized by bacteriae in chlorella's habitat

    Isn't bacteria (e.g. Propionibacterium freudenreichii) also how vegan B12 is produced already today? So for me personally it's pretty much the same process as we know it for years without involvement of algae.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

    Thank you kindly for sharing, I hadn't considered that! That makes complete sense.

    I assume bioavailability might favor the ancient practice of natural symbiosis of bacteria with plants in their natural habitat anyways, and acknowledge we can certainly recreate such environment well to farm vitamin B12 specifically.

    The large range of nutrients accounts to me favoring chlorella over other options.

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    As alluded to in further comments, certain plants do naturally contain vitamin B12 (seemingly produced by bacteria in their environment).

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  • [–] [S] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, I hear that the B12 vitamin amount for mushrooms is unreliable. I am not certain about other plants, or if there is another reliable source.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

    Anecdotally:

    I have watched a ~3 minute video on B12 availability somewhere within the past 6 months.

    It entailed that B12 gets mainly produced by symbiotic plants and used to naturally be in humans' and plants' diets. According to the video due to the antibacterial and anti 'this that and the other' chemical treatments we treat our produce with, the B12 produced by the bacteria disappeared in our produce.

    It absolutely impacted me hearing that (again, according to that video) the B12 in animals and their produce mostly gets added by supplements into their diets (since the plants we feed them don't contain the B12 vitamins anymore due to pesticides and such) which means (according to the video) most of the "natural" B12 in animals is chemically produced B12 and only B12 of plants which can live symbiotically with certain bacteria contain "natural" vitamin B12.

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