nK bAd!!! (lemmy.ml)
submitted 6 months ago by to c/memes@lemmy.ml
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[+] 13 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (9 children)
  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (8 children)

    Thanks.

    I'll have to read more about Korean Nationalism. As to poverty, you make fair points. As to universal conscription, I object to it in all circumstances regardless of wartime vs peace, as it is literally slavery. Other countries doing it doesn't make it better.

    As to Democracy, I am confused by the claim

    the DPRK is the only socialist country that has implemented direct elections at all levels

    When the source later says

    All of these mass organisations make up the Democratic Front...the potential nomination is debated and discussed at many mass meetings, and only then is the final candidate nominated for elections to the SPA.

    I fail to see the "direct election" in this process. It seems like a committee that theoretically takes into consideration debate and opinion but which then makes a unilateral nomination, who runs unopposed. Am I missing something?

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  • [+] 10 points 6 months ago (5 children)
  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago* (4 children)

    It isn’t literally slavery

    How would you define slavery? Do you see it as only applicable in the context of commodity production?

    Candidates that are selected run unopposed, on a “yes/no” basis

    I may look more into the book. Curious if you know of any data on how common it is for candidates to lose an election once nominated? I have to say, even the Yes/No voting is done properly, the lack of an open primary or similar seems to preclude the idea of "direct elections".

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  • [+] 9 points 6 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    universal conscription is similar to how people are forced to go to school in most societies

    I recognize the difference you are making, but this seems like huge a stretch. Children's lack of knowledge requires some degree of restriction on autonomy at least to a certain age, in the interest of preparing them for life. Personally I think school mandates are excessive in most countries, but it is still very different from a mandatory activity for adults. Moreover, the military represents a far greater risk of personal harm. As to the idea that it is self-organizing, the degree to which that is true rests heavily on the democracy question.

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  • [+] 7 points 6 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    Further, I am not purely speaking of children, but also full adults getting their medical degrees and having to give back to the system by going to the areas most in need for a time.

    I definitely oppose that. It might just be a difference in values.

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  • [+] 7 points 6 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    I actually live in a country that claims to be socialist, but I'm not sure they have gone very far to earn that label.

    Cuba...doctors

    AFAIK no one is forced to become a doctor in Cuba

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    I fail to see the "direct election" in this process. It seems like a committee that theoretically takes into consideration debate and opinion but which then makes a unilateral nomination, who runs unopposed. Am I missing something?

    By direct election, what's meant is that all levels of government, from the local, to national level, are elected directly by the people.

    Contrast this with it's neighbor China, where local level positions are directly elected, but by the time you get to the national level, positions are elected, indirectly, by the directly elected representatives from the lower levels. The DPRK doesn't have that same sort of insulation at the national level.

    Candidates, meanwhile, are decided through mass meetings. This is a very loose comparison, but imagine something roughly akin to the caucus system in some USAmerican primary elections. But instead of boiling it down to two candidates, it gets boiled down to one. The final vote where you cast your ballot is essentially a ratification vote of that 'primary' process, where you vote "yes" or "no", but that doesn't mean the process which preceded it wasn't competitive.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Thank you for clarifying. Voting directly in this sense is perhaps more democratic than delegation. Whether this system is democratic, though, really comes down to how the committees are run. Before having read the book mentioned, I am skeptical that a "democratic" process should rely so heavily on something as imprecise as a committee.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago

    It's a bit difficult to say how institutionally robust these meetings are, simply because the DPRK is so artificially closed off from the world.

    The Cuban electoral system works roughly similar, with direct elections at all levels of government, mass meetings narrowing down to one candidate, and ratification votes at the end of the process. And we have a much better window into how those work.

    Obviously that's a country on the other side of the world, so we can't just graft the Cuban experience onto the DPRK, but it can help us be more informed in our speculation

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