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Weekly Recommendations Thread: What are you playing this week? (sh.itjust.works)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/patientgamers@sh.itjust.works
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[–] 1 point 1 year ago (6 children)

I love both games. I think NGB is a better game, but NG2 has higher highs. The combat in NG2 is more viscerally satisfying and fun to play around with, but the game is an unfinished, untested and unbalanced mess. I still love it, and Chapter 1 of NG2 is the best Ninja Gaiden level or the whole series, but NGB feels much more complete and balanced.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (5 children)

    From the shit Flying Swallow to the nonlinear level design, my issue with NGB is it's less committed to being an action game.

    To me, NG2 is 3D Ninja Gaiden finding and accepting what it is: a brutal action game where nothing matters but combat interactions. Level design and balance be damned: it's combat, combat, and more combat.

    In that way NG2 is one of the most unique games out there. I can maybe liken it to God Hand, but NG2's commitment to nonstop combat is so singularly deranged.

    For that same reason I always found it difficult to compare them because they clearly set out to achieve different goals. It just happens that what NG2 tried to do is exactly what I need as an action game fan.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    If they would have finished and polished NG2 then it could have been the best action game of all time, for sure. It still delivers that "playable cocaine" feeling that's very unique, and Chapter 1 of NG2 is probably the best level in the whole franchise and one of the best action game levels of all time.

    The problem is all the absolute nonsense in the game, and the abundance of pretty much garbage levels. I think like half the levels in the game are outright bad. Also stuff like how completely broken UTs are. It's obvious the game wasn't fully playtested and balanced, and so the super powered UTs were slapped on as a bandaid. But they're not really fun to use and end result is a mechanic that you at best feel forced to resort to just to get through levels, but most of the time try to actively avoid using in order to actually have fun.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (3 children)

    The problem is all the absolute nonsense in the game, and the abundance of pretty much garbage levels. I think like half the levels in the game are outright bad.

    I don't think it has more garbage levels than Bayonetta or The Wonderful 101, for example. Like 3 or 4 bad levels? Predominantly where you have water, bow and arrow, and bullshit enemy behavior/checkpoint placement segments.

    Most bosses suck in both games, and in most action games, TBH. I don't understand why they're hellbent on serving us giant monstrosities. Action games need more humanoid bosses overall.

    Also stuff like how completely broken UTs are. It’s obvious the game wasn’t fully playtested and balanced, and so the super powered UTs were slapped on as a bandaid. But they’re not really fun to use and end result is a mechanic that you at best feel forced to resort to just to get through levels, but most of the time try to actively avoid using in order to actually have fun.

    How are they broken? You absolutely have to earn using them and be strategic about it. Enemies will mess you up if you misuse OTs on higher difficulties.

    IME, most action games feel messier than they actually are on the first playthrough and the more you replay them, the more patterns start to emerge and first playthrough issues fade.

    Now, if you didn't enjoy the first playthrough enough to go back for more that's fair, and a rather big risk these games typically take.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    UTs were perfectly balanced in NGB in my opinion. You need a perfect equilibrium between the power/damage of the move, the amount of safety it gives you (i-frames), the charge time it requires and the enemy count (essence generation). NGB hit all of these were UTs were a powerful tool that felt earned whenever you pulled them off and never too powerful.

    In NG2 you get an eternity of i-frames, insane tracking that often has you teleporting around the room between enemies (like Tonfas) and a delimb system that means it's easier for UTs to feed themselves. Which is exacerbated by the design philosophy being "kill hordes of enemies quickly" without tweaking the 2-essence-cost of a full charge UT and even reducing the basic charge time.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    See, this is why I think the comparison doesn't work. They may be called UTs and function the same as they do in NGB, but enemies behavior is different. If my only strategy is UT spamming regardless of context, I'll get my teeth kicked in because enemies are too aggressive, volatile, and while they're not as tanky as they are in NGB, they attack in larger numbers.

    Timing is also key if I aim to use essence to instant charge UTs/OL UT. I windrun at the wrong time, and enemies will hunt me down because their tracking is also ridiculous, never mind suicide runs.

    All that space between UTs is not exactly a walk in the park and there's so much to be aware of and get right before you can reliably pull them off to the extent that undermines difficulty in a game where one mistake can easily snowball into a good chunk of your health gone.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Caveat is I have not played NG2 on Master Ninja because I already hate myself enough, I don't need more misery . Apart from some single chapter challenge stuff I guess. But I have never felt like pulling off UTs was significantly challenging compared to relying on combos and OTs. You're moving around so much anyway that an on-landing UT is often easy to pull off as long as you have 2 essences in the air.

    What I find most fun in NG2 combat is using all the combos from the move list of the various weapons, and using OTs strategically for i-frames. But UT spam just seems so much more efficient and easy.

    Maybe Master Ninja is significantly different, I don't know.

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