If 4chan continues to ignore Ofcom, the forum could be blocked in the UK. And 4chan could face even bigger fines totaling about $23 million or 10 percent of 4chan’s worldwide turnover, whichever is higher. 4chan also faces potential arrest and/or "imprisonment for a term of up to two years," the lawsuit said.

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[–] 185 points 1 year ago (57 children)

The UK should just block sites that don't comply. They have no business trying to fine US websites.

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  • [–] 30 points 1 year ago (16 children)

    Imagine for a moment that 4chan is a business that sells alcoholic beverages in the US. Now imagine the UK has instituted prohibition and banned the consumption of alcohol.

    now, some enterprising individuals have taken it upon themselves to buy, smuggle, and then sell those beverages inside the UK.

    Clearly, the government has intended to ban the consumption of alcohol, not the sale of it.

    Now the UK government is trying to shackle hefty fines against an American company for having the "audacity" of selling a product to an individual within the confines of the US.

    again, the UK banned the consumption of alcohol, not the sale of. 4Chan isn't forcing UK citizens to drink the alcohol. They are simply selling the product, within their country of origin, to individuals who want to purchase it.

    now, do you still think the UK government has a right to fine 4chan or do you think maybe the UK government should elaborate on their prohibition regulations to ensure their citizens are properly "protected"?

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  • [–] 25 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    gonna be honest, I didn't read anything past this part.

    So in your scenario here, 4chan starts off by smuggling alcohol into the UK.

    I didn't read any of it because you clearly didn't read what I said.

    here's the part you conveniently forgot and it literally changes the entire argument.

    some enterprising individuals have taken it upon themselves to buy, smuggle, and then sell those beverages inside the UK.

    next time you want to argue your point don't employ the use of bad faith tactics and try to argue your point without manufacturing flaws.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    long, horizontal scroll boxes of text that isn't code
    proper blockquotes elsewhere

    You clearly know how to blockquote: use it correctly.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

    Nope: the horizontal scroll boxes (marked up as code blocks) don't contain code & no one should have to horizontally scroll long prose. Those code blocks should be blockquotes.

    Mozilla’s blockquote documentation

    The markdown documentation is built right into the lemmy editor (as the help icon).

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    Edited it. Hows that?

    Looks like it doesn't get rendered correctly on my end

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    now, some enterprising individuals have taken it upon themselves to buy, smuggle, and then sell those beverages inside the UK

    Wouldn't it be more akin to those individuals putting the alcohol into 4chan's trucks that are taking other stuff to the UK? (and worse with 4chan's knowledge)

    In that case do you think it's unreasonable that the uk government imposes penalties for 4chan refusing to remove the alcohol that they know is there from the trucks.

    And then if 4chan then refuses to pay said penalties start to not allow them to bring any trucks into the uk at all?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    the "trucks" in your example are the users computers/phones.

    the highways are the Internet, which is owned and maintained by the UK government after their "gate".

    the alcohol is the content.

    4chans trucks deliver to the UKs "gate" and the UK user does the rest from there on the UK highways.

    if the UK doesn't want the alcohol in their country, they need to stop their citizens from purchasing it and block it from entering their country at their "gate".

    this is what any reasonable country would do. they (UK) already do it for actual physical products like potassium bromate, azodicarbonamide, and certain artificial food dyes like Yellow 5 and Yellow 6.

    Are they going to sue or fine the companies that manufacture those products? no. They're going to ban the products that use them and then go after the individuals that smuggle them in.

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  • [–] 54 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Not you again... genuinely convinced this user is a bot. He made this same argument a month ago on a now deleted post almost verbatim. I disputed his claims with evidence and they continuously moved the goalpost through the entire argument. either braindead or just software please ignore.

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  • [–] 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Not who you replied to, but: there is no legal, ethical, or moral, requirement for a business of one country to comply with the laws of another. If there was, all business would be beholden to the most overbearing government on any one subject. And just to specifically state it before it’s brought up, being tied into the international banking system doesn’t change that; if a state doesn’t want its citizenry doing business with a particular entity, it’s on them to stop it on their side or come to an agreement with the other’s government. Which does happen, especially with the conglomerate hegemony of components of the international banking system, but naturally that means that the only time any entity of a state is forced to comply with the laws of another is when their home-state demands it, which ultimately isn’t the laws of the other.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Their payment processor is operating in the UK though. 4chan isn't refusing money from UK residents. It is accepting their payments.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    4Chan doesn’t have their own personal payment processor that they’re responsible for. They’re tied into processors like stripe and accept all payments that make it to them on the US side. So long as it is legal, which is typically the only way that a payment actually goes through as processors refuse the obviously illegal cases like encompassing embargoes. If the UK doesn’t want payments going to 4chan through a processor that operates in their country, it’s on them to stop the payment processor on their end.

    The UK knows this, the fines are just one step towards them petitioning processors.

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  • [–] 39 points 1 year ago (15 children)

    Why should that be their problem?

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  • [+] -14 points 1 year ago* (14 children)

    Because they're doing business in that region. You don't just get to go to another country and do business as you please there.

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  • [–] 36 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    Isn't it people in the UK that go to a US company and do business there?

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    Not with the internet. 4chan uses a payment processor that allows UK residents to pay with UK currency.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    "Allows" - do they do anything specifically for the UK?

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (8 children)

    They allow UK residents to use a credit or debit card to pay for passes.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    "allow"

    Seems to me as if the people in the UK sign up with an american company.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    4chan has not disabled accepting payments from UK residents through their Coinbase portal. Therefore they are allowing UK residents to pay them.

    4chan is not geo blocking UK visitors in their Cloudflare portal, so they are allowing UK residents to visit their site.

    4chan wants all the benefits of UK business without obeying their laws.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    4chan isn't in the UK and has no reason to figure out what laws apply there.

    When you made this post, did you first check which countries your post ended up in?

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (4 children)

    4chan agreed to the terms of service agreement here:

    https://www.coinbase.com/legal/user_agreement/united_states

    • Legislative and regulatory changes or actions at the state, federal, or international level may adversely affect the use, transfer, exchange, and value of virtual currency.

    That means they agree their business can be affected by international regulations.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    I know, its hard to believe your eyes, but it does say they can be adversely affected by international legislation and regulations if they want to do business there.

    They could always opt to use a US-based payment processor that doesn't deal with international payments.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    It specifically talks about the value of crypto currency, which can be affected by any number of external events. I'm going to assume you're simply trolling now.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago*

    Your company’s policies, procedures, and activities which relate to the Services, in each case to the extent reasonably necessary for Coinbase to comply with any applicable laws, rules, and regulations (including money laundering statutes, regulations and conventions of the United States or other jurisdictions), or the guidance or direction of, or request from, any regulatory authority or financial institution.

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  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago* (5 children)

    Extort, you mean. The law threatens them with abduction and being held in captivity.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    What? No it doesn’t, not as long as the people responsible don’t step foot in the UK.

    If they do - yes they’ll be arrested for having broken UK law.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    I guess thats not a threat? Not sure what else youd classify that as. "If you step on our turf you're going to be jailed" is just peaceful language haha

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    You have to obey the law of whatever country you are currently occupying, even if the rule is bad shit crazy, actually especially if the rule is bat shit crazy. There are plenty of people who have done nothing wrong who would be arrested if they step foot in China, but that doesn't really bother anyone because they don't step foot in China.

    Also it would be interesting to see what they would even be charged with, since offcom don't really have authority to issue arrest warrants. Ofcom barely have the authority to enforce UK law in the UK. Otherwise the likes of GB news wouldn't exist.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    You have to obey the law of whatever country you are currently occupying.

    They're not "occupying" or even operating here. all the servers have been in Texas since 2008. The British gov are attempting to legislate feature implementations for companies that aren't operating in britain. it's ridiculous.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago

    Apparently they are operating in the UK though apparently they are selling some kind of pro service, so they are operating in the UK. To be clear it's a stupid law, but it is the law.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    It's an interesting idea that countries could only fine websites that operate in said country. Could get away with a lot by finding a permissive country to do what would otherwise be illegal and worth of fines.

    "Selling user's private information illegally? Buddy, Tuvalo don't care"

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Nope lol, countries definitely try to fine websites not operated in the same country. Sometimes they're just not succesful

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    The uk is irrelevant anyways. They will not be missed when they strengthen the Great Firewall rules

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