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[+] -39 points 1 year ago (33 children)
  • [–] 40 points 1 year ago

    Anti-homeless architecture is meant to encourage homeless people to actually go to homeless shelters

    Umm no… anti-homeless architecture isn’t meant to encourage people to go to homeless shelters, it’s meant to make it inconvenient to be homeless where “rich people” might have to see and acknowledge you. Its goal is to make the problem easier to ignore not drive people to get help.

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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    but even if we had enough of that, there’d still be mentally ill people and drug addicts that would prefer to live on the street

    How about we get there first and then you can hand wring about any of these supposed people who are left?

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  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Shelters, even if there was enough space, can be dangerous for vulnerable people, do not allow pets, and rarely provide medium term housing or transitional opportunity.

    Anti-homeless architecture simply attempts to push the houseless further away from urban centers, and consequently food kitchens, shelters, and other resources. This is deadly when extreme weather occurs or acute health problems arise.

    It actively makes the city more dangerous to those most fucked by society.

    As far as "wanting" to live on the street, this is a narrative made up to victim blame and deny empathy. It only needs one or two examples for the false narrative to be cast on the population writ large.

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  • [+] -18 points 1 year ago (7 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    It's a political problem. Houseless people are there because there's no political willpower to create systematic change to support them. So you're absolutely right when you say:

    we must either come up with new resources or reevaluate our investments in the resources we currently employ.

    The only problem is the answer to this question is more often on the side of the investment not being worth it, so the problem is left unaddressed.

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  • [+] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I've worked with hundreds of homeless people, usually trying to help them before the cops sweep their camp, or keeping their car rolling so they can keep living in it.

    There was a ubiquitous set of conditions:

    • can't afford housing even though they had a job.
    • lost identifying documents, usually in a sweep, and working on replacing them. You can't get work without these.
    • no reliable postal address
    • no support network

    I've never met anyone who wanted to be living on the street.

    I'm not talking about crust punks train hopping. I'm talking about the people who missed a day of work for whatever reason and couldn't make rent one month. Now they're in a tent near available services because the shelter kicked them out after the max stay of a week.

    Being a therapist gives you no expertise here and it seems to me that a therapist who sees punishment as a viable means for behavioral change is kind of shit at their job.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Hey maybe I'm stupid too, but it seems to me it'd be way fucking easier and cheaper to just put some flyers in a little letterbox attached to the bench advertising the nearest homeless shelter or something, rather than inconveniencing literally everyone who wants to use the bench. But what do I know, I'm probably just stupid

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  • [+] -3 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    Literally anyone using the bench potentially prevents someone else from also using the bench. Why is it a bigger deal when it's a homeless person doing the using? Also, I'm sure there are other more attention grabbing options than a flyer, if we use our imaginations a little bit. Why is your focus on prevention and not education/outreach anyways?

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  • [+] -2 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    What difference does to make if someone is sitting on the bench, laying down, standing, crouching, or in any other comfortable resting position? It's a public bench, to be used by the public however they see fit, as long as they're not causing harm.

    It's weird to enforce the "correct" usage of a public bench, or the "correct" amount of space a person is allowed to take up, especially with such drastic elements that you yourself admit are not very effective.

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Imagine trying to spin anti-homeless architecture as pro-homeless.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago*

    "Welcome! What brings you to the homeless shelter today?"

    "Well, it's that bench. You see, I was choosing the unhoused lifestyle, and I was fine with all the other stigma and physical discomforts, until I realized that the city wants to discourage my presence in public spaces. Fuck these armrests, I decided I'd just come to this shelter, get treatment for my addiction, get counseling for my traumatic past that fed the addiction, get an education, get a job, rent a house, save money, then buy a home instead. It's just not worth trying to get comfy on that bench."

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  • [–] 19 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    That may be true in some cases but most of the time anti homeless street furniture is just made to get homeless people to not hang around that particular area.

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  • [+] -19 points 1 year ago (4 children)
  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Why do you believe I see homeless people as less than myself? Quite a lot of people are only a short term breakdown away from being homeless, especially in ultra capitalist places like the US. Certainly they need help, but help is not always directly available, and you want to argue that while they look for help, making the world as hostile as possible is a good thing? And then you try to gaslight me with that? I think you need help.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (13 children)

    Amazingly, you think because someone has a mental illness that they chose to live on the street.

    You: "I'm sure if given the chance to have a place to live, an unhoused person would reject it"

    They remove benches and rest stops/bus shelters to stop the unhoused from occupying them to the detriment of people using the service. And you see nothing wrong with that.

    It's very obvious to most why this is done.

    But not you.

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  • [+] -18 points 1 year ago (13 children)
  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Says they are a therapist and that they know better than anyone. Doesn't know anything about me.

    HOW EMBARRASSING IT MUST BE FOR YOU TO EXIST.

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  • [+] -4 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    You still don't get it, do you?

    You have no idea how you appear to be insulting because your head is so far up your ass you smell like meconium.

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  • [+] -2 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago*

    I'm just responding with the same energy that you gave me.

    "Grow up", that is rich coming from you. Lol You made my day, thanks.

    Edit: BTW the meconium statement was a dig at your maturity. I'm sad you didn't get it but I'm not surprised.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    I've actually been homeless. Have you?

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  • [+] -1 points 1 year ago (4 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    When I was homeless all the shelters were full, and housing was a year plus wait for anything. I often slept in a concrete tube under a bridge. Then the government came in, removed the tubes, and puts spikes all over the concrete under the bridge. Yes I felt it was an attack. I was forced to move further out from where I could attain help, and do something to sustain myself, only making it harder for me to exist. Dealing with the government to maintain my place of residence, and medical treatment, is a part time job, where I spend, literally, 4-6 hours on hold with places like Jobs and Family Services, and the local housing authority. I can absolutely understand how easy it would be for me to stay homeless if I were say, schizophrenic. Luckily I am not, and I can maintain things like schedules, keep dozens of appointments per month, etc.

    This is one of the worst possible ways to encourage people to seek help. it shows a deep lack of understanding what day-to-day life is for the homeless, especially ones who are very mentally ill.

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  • [+] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    All that it does is push homeless people out of the area. That is all that you are accomplishing. This will not force those who do not seek help, to seek help, it just pushes them out of sight. No matter what you say, this is the point, to push the homeless out of the area, they do not give a single fuck about getting them help. If they did, instead of making it so people couldn't lay down, or sit, in public, they would be putting far more money into mental health facilities, and other aspects of life that makes, and keeps, people homeless.

    But no, just make it so they can't lay down in your area, that will make it better. It also makes life worse for people who are not homeless, especially the elderly, and disabled. This type of thinking also leads to the privatization of public spaces, reducing resources to everyone, that have a demonstrably positive affect on people. Part-and-parcel of hostile architecture initiatives are also legal punitive ones, to enforce the removal of unwanted people in areas that they can't specifically do something like put spikes on. The very morality behind "defensive" architecture is called into question, because of the line of thinking you put forward is little more than an excuse to push undesirables away from society.

    https://english.artsci.udel.edu/arak-journal-article/?id=169

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b57726adb2fe4f91bd1a7356f7e74551

    https://ltu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/Berdan_Report.pdf

    https://nchv.org/policing-and-punishment-based-approaches-a-really-expensive-way-to-make-homelessness-worse/

    There are more, if you would like, everything I have ever found on this subject has read "we can prove many negative aspects of doing, and there might be some good aspects, but it isn't as evident, and often can possibly be explained by other factors", so I don't even really see research backing up this idea you propose.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Luckily, I became homeless in very late '99, where at least the area I was in, didn't have anti-sleeping measures installed on public benches, yet. Until I secured a shitty car to live out of, on the days I wasn't lucky to have a friend offer a spot to crash, parks were the only hope. I was removed by the police from them a bunch of times, told I cannot be sleeping there. When asked if they know any place I could spend the night, they spent zero time trying to help me. Told me to get out of there already.
    It was really tempting to commit a crime, serious enough to get booked for few days, where I could catch up on sleep without freezing. Fact those benches didn't have anti-sleeping measures, made for a few great nights where I could get some decent rest, which wouldn't have happened nowadays. So yeah, hard to say it's not an attack on homeless people, specially when the public servants have zero fucks to help you out.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Get educated before you spout off, nitwit.

    Oh, the irony! 🤣

    You do realize you're just embarrassing yourself all over this thread, right?

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