cross-posted from: https://hexbear.net/post/7760707

"Death to Germany because they say their reason for existing is to support 'Israel'^[Not a joke, they call this "Staatsräson".]? That's genocidal against Germans."

Sorry, but I don't care about your colonizer fragility.

amerikkka germany-cool eu-cool isntrael qin-shi-huangdi-fireball

"Colonized masses should have their stolen land returned and have self-determination" above a reaction image labeled "white people:" of a white man saying "They're gonna hunt me for sport?"
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[–] [S] 8 points 8 months ago* (11 children)

I'm not sure I understand what this comment means.

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  • [+] -6 points 8 months ago (10 children)

    Mocking left-wing nationalists since it doesn't solve anything for those actually being oppressed (3rd world proletariat) and just promotes "blood and soil" type shit

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  • [–] [S] 12 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 child)

    I'm still not sure I understand. Are you saying that it doesn't help the third world proletariat for stolen land to be returned to them and for them to have self-determination? Would it not help Palestinians to have their land returned and have control of their own nation?

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago

    No it doesn't help the proletariat, it only changes who the oppressor is and arguably only makes it easier and cheaper in the long run for foreign imperial powers to economically exploit them.

    This article honestly sums it up better than I ever could and isn't too long, I'd recommend giving it a read.

    Also, national liberation would simply not work in Palestine - after all, do you really believe that if Palestinians came out furiously waving their flags one morning, it'd make Israel (which is another national liberation state btw) feel bad and stop their genocide and settling?

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  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago

    how? the people of the global south to my experiece see their role in the world to act as responsible parties to the land they are indigenous to. the people of the global north, be they 1st world or 2nd world, have invaded this land, don't respect its laws, and have claimed it as their own. this is what is meant by stolen land. it's not a blood and soil thing where the land belongs to the people via bloodright. it's more accurate to say the people belong to the land, be that indigenous american relationships to turtle island or the concept in palestinian teaching that they are seeds.

    i'm ready adjust my stance, but your notion that landback movements to return people to their stolen land and allow them to manage their society based on their relationship to the land being anti-left, or even fascist, strikes me as very odd at best, and possibly paternalistic at worst

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  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (6 children)

    National liberation from imperialism and colonialism is a good thing, actually.

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  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (5 children)

    As a Motor for liberation.

    Nationalism must be abandoned and the national Elite is not allowed to be formed, be it bureaucratic or capitalist.

    Otherwise it is just a vehicle from one oppression to the next.

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (4 children)

    Nationalism as a reaction to imperialism and colonialism is progressive, and aids the liberatory movement. Nationalism in the context of an imperialist country solidifies imperialism. Nationalism is not something that exists in the abstract, but instead is highly contextual.

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    i think i'd clarify that there's a difference between having a national identity and organizing a state around national supremacism. i want to live in a place where i am allowed to be Appalachian. i do not want to live in a place where Appalachian is a state promoted identity and other identities are excluded

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