Where I live, I have to have this conversation way too often with people. Early Modern Period (~1600 AD) Medieval Period (~1000 AD) (thelemmy.club)
 
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[–] 45 points 6 months ago (9 children)

So many things are just ideas. It's really fascinating how some ideas can snowball and give incredible power to those in possession of them, while others can be very advanced, yet have minimal effect in the culture's spread or influence.

Austronesian peoples discovered the fire piston - a very useful tool that necessarily utilizes concepts of air pressure and localized temperature - nearly three thousand years ahead of Europeans. Yet some Austronesian peoples who used this tool were quite literally in the stone age, not working metal.

Ideas are incredibly arbitrary things.

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  • [–] 11 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (3 children)

    Europeans were using roman numerals and an abacus for accounting until the 1200s. In fact, the number zero was initially banned out of concern for fraud. The Medici Bank was an early adopter of the IndoArab numeral system we use today and it helped them become one of the wealthiest families in Europe.

    From the 600s to 1400s we can draw a fairly clear line from Aryabhata, Brahmagupta, Fibonacci, Pierro della Franchesca to Leonardo da Vinci.

    In the old world it could take centuries for ideas to travel, even if they're foundational to modern mathematics, physics etc.

    A similar story can be told of sugar which was first refined in South Asia, the engineering process travelled through and was further developed in the Arab world during the Islamic golden age and then went to Europe.

    Italian merchant republics—primarily Venice—began managing sugar production in Mediterranean colonies like Cyprus, Crete, and Sicily. However, sugar is a land-hungry and wood-hungry crop. By the 1400s, the Mediterranean was running out of timber (needed to fuel the massive boiling vats) and space.

    Christopher Columbus lived in Portugal and married the daughter of a sugar estate owner. When he sailed for the Americas, he brought sugarcane stalks from the Canary Islands on his very first voyage, knowing the Caribbean climate was a perfect match for the "white gold."

    The Caribbean offered vast land, tropical rain, and timber. Because the process of cutting, hauling, and boiling cane is so physically punishing and dangerous, European powers scaled up the enslaved labor system to a level never before seen in the Mediterranean, turning the islands into "sugar factories" to meet the soaring demand in Europe.

    The profits from sugar were unlike anything seen before. At its peak, a successful sugar plantation could see annual returns of 20% to 50%, far outstripping traditional agriculture or local trade. This led to the founding of institutions like the Bank of England, Barclays and Lloyds. Sugar also provided a cheap source or energy and made caffeine based beverages more palatable to maximize the productivity of human capital in operation of early machinery during the industrial revolution.

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  • [–] 8 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    "Also, you can just make sugar out of beets."

    Europe, having spent the past ~300 years importing sugar cane as a specialized tropical crop: 😬

    Ideas are worth more than gold!

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  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 child)

    Absolutely. Napolean and trade barriers had an important role in that evolution

    During the Napoleonic Wars, the British Royal Navy blockaded France, cutting off all Caribbean cane sugar. The price of sugar loaf skyrocketed. Facing a riotous, sugar-deprived public, Napoleon poured state funding into beet research. ​He ordered thousands of acres to be planted and offered massive prizes to scientists who could refine the process. By the time the blockade lifted, the industry was advanced enough to compete with cane on a price-per-pound basis.

    It's remarkable how much of human history (if not all of it) is adapting to the circumstances around us.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (4 children)

    Yeah, they invented typesetting in China long before Europe, but they had to prepare characters for each run because of amount of possible characters, the letters were pottery, and it didn't seem like very useful thing so it was abandoned after the inventor's death.

    At least that's what I heard, it might be a retcon for PR purposes

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    Not a retcon at all! Though use of moveable type in China did continue past its inventor's death, it didn't acquire the same prominence or revolutionize printing the way that it did when invented in Europe.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago

    This reminds me how setting prints letter-by-letter was time consuming, so the printers had common words or even whole phrases ready too. It was called stereotype.

    In France they called it cliché...

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    Well, TIL, still I think it really highlights that some ideas need specific circumstances to create an impact

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